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Monday's Top 10 with NZ Mint; Can Europe survive? economics in denial; complexity; what China should really do; hunger; dry Australia?; Dilbert

Monday's Top 10 with NZ Mint; Can Europe survive? economics in denial; complexity; what China should really do; hunger; dry Australia?; Dilbert

Here's my Top 10 links from around the Internet at 10:00 am today in association with NZ Mint.

Bernard will be back with his version tomorrow.

As always, we welcome your additions in the comments below or via email to bernard.hickey@interest.co.nz.

See all previous Top 10s here.

 

1. Can Europe survive the rise of the rest?
Oxford professor Timothy Garton Ash says the five great drivers of European unification since the 1950s have now either disappeared or lost much of their energy.

But he says, the 21st-century world will be one of giants: weary old ones, like the United States and Russia, and hungry new ones, like China, India, Brazil and South Africa. You do not need to accept the most apocalyptic forecasts of European decline to acknowledge that Europe is unlikely to remain the world’s largest economy for long. In such a world, even Germany will be a small- to medium-size power.

He thinks there is a chance the European ship can be re-floated, but worries young Spaniards or Greeks can't see the point. Europe needs to do two things that look unlikely; co-operate, and act.

Who won the most medals at the Olympics? Europe. Who has the largest economy in the world? Europe again. And where do most people want to go on holiday? Europe, of course. On many measures of power, the European Union belongs with the United States and China in a global Big Three. Yet say that to officials in Beijing, Washington or any other world capital today and they would probably laugh out loud. As European leaders stagger into yet another round of crisis summitry, this potential superpower is widely viewed as the sick man of the developed world.

2. Economics in denial
Former ECB boss Trichet has appealed for inspiration from other disciplines – physics, engineering, psychology, and biology – to help explain the phenomena he had experienced as a central banker at the heart of the storm; he felt let down by economics. It was a remarkable cry for help, and a serious indictment of the economics profession, not to mention all those extravagantly rewarded finance professors in business schools.

So far, relatively little help has been forthcoming from the engineers and physicists in whom Trichet placed his faith, though there has been some response. Robert May, an eminent climate change expert, has argued that techniques from his discipline may help explain financial-market developments. Epidemiologists have suggested that the study of how infectious diseases are propagated may illuminate the unusual patterns of financial contagion that we have seen in the last five years.

These are fertile fields for future study, but what of the core disciplines of economics and finance themselves? Can nothing be done to make them more useful in explaining the world as it is, rather than as it is assumed to be in their stylised models?

Fortunately, others in the profession do aspire to relevance, and they have been chastened by the events of the last five years, when price movements that the models predicted should occur once in a million years were observed several times a week. They are working hard to understand why, and to develop new approaches to measuring and monitoring risk, which is the main current concern of many banks.

These efforts are arguably as important as the specific and detailed regulatory changes about which we hear much more. Our approach to regulation in the past was based on the assumption that financial markets could to a large extent be left to themselves, and that financial institutions and their boards were best placed to control risk and defend their firms.

These assumptions took a hard hit in the crisis, causing an abrupt shift to far more intrusive regulation. Finding a new and stable relationship between the financial authorities and private firms will depend crucially on a reworking of our intellectual models. So the Bank of England is right to issue a call to arms. Economists would be right to heed it.

 

3. Indescribable complexity
We freely criticise politicians who can't manage through our problems, and yet we vote for the ones who can articulate a plausible, simple solution to these issues. But it is all hubris, says Donald Boudreaux. People who do understand (ie: you!) can't get elected. A detailed and complex solution never won any attention, let alone a vote.

A market economy is indescribably vast and complex - its success depends on so many intricate, changing details all somehow being made to work smoothly together that the “facts” that are essential to its thriving cannot be catalogued with anywhere near the completeness that can be achieved by a 21st-century scientist studying and cataloging the “facts” that enable sparrows to fly. A sparrow is complex compared, say, to a limestone rock. Compared to the modern market economy, however, a sparrow is extremely simple.

Nevertheless, too many people, including politicians, continue to believe that because they can observe a handful of bulky facts about the economy, they can thereby know enough to intervene into that economy in ways that will improve its operation. That belief, though, is hubris. It’s very much like believing that you’ll fly if you simply strap on a pair of wings and commence to flapping madly.

4. Lets get one thing clear
A lot has been said about the pros and cons of financial globalisation. But what exactly is ‘financial globalisation’? Francisco Ceballos, Tatiana Didier, Sergio Schmukler, argue that we can’t be clear about the pros and cons of financial globalisation unless we are clear on what it actually is.

Financial globalisation – and de-globalisation – is a topic at the heart of the financial reform policies being discussed in reaction to the global crisis and more recently the Eurozone crisis. Academic attention, however, goes back much further, sparked by heightened financial globalisation and transmission of shocks and crises.

Yet despite all this attention, the concept ‘financial globalisation’ remain somewhat elusive and its measurement problematic. There are at least two interconnected, albeit essentially distinct dimensions of financial globalisation.

• Financial diversification, that is, the cross-country holdings of foreign assets and liabilities; and

• Financial offshoring, that is, the use of foreign jurisdictions to conduct financial transactions.

While the former focuses on who holds the assets, the latter deals with where the assets are transacted.

5. China's growing economic crisis
Bloomberg's William Pesek says if China isn’t a gigantic bubble economy, it’s one made up of many smaller bubbles - property, stocks, exports. These are the result of spending-induced growth and imbalances that might breed trouble down the road, including inflation and a bad-loan crisis. More here »

One problem is that China has run out of obvious ways to kick-start its $7.3 trillion economy. It was easy in 2008: Pump tens of billions of dollars into a sweeping stimulus project and 10 percent growth followed. China’s success gave markets the impression that its leaders could wave some magic wand and growth would be the result.

Magic is in short supply now. Local governments are cash- strapped and awash in debts that could turn bad. The euro zone seems locked into permanent-crisis mode while the U.S. is bogged down with debt, economic stagnation and political paralysis. China proved it can live for a few years without U.S. and European customers, but not forever.

6. If they don't build houses, what should they build?
One natural question to ask about the widespread notion that China is engaged in too much residential investment and transportation infrastructure projects is: What else should they be building instead? Yichuan Wang thinks he has the answer, but I think his argument underscores what's unsustainable about the current Chinese direction:

I want them to start building leaf blowers, so we don't have so many Chinese people in the low productivity position of sweeping streets. I want them to start building farm equipment, so we don't have so many Chinese farmers tending the fields. I want them to build more laundry machines, to free the rural Chinese from scrubbing clothes on washboards. I want them to build electric stoves, so my Grandpa can put away the coal fired outside oven. I want them to build computers that can deliver cheaper education to the masses.

Instead of just focusing on "building," I want them to invest in human capital, so productivity can be at a level that we don't need "make work" jobs. I want them to build more schools and hire better teachers, so classes aren't as large and you're not damned if you can't make it in a top elementary school. I want productivity to be high enough that high end stores don't need more clerks than actual customers.

7. China Inc's debacle in the outback
We should not forget that when 'we' sell 'our' assets to foreigners, they get the assets but we get their money. We have a tendency to assume that the foriegners are smart and we are dumb - the modern version of 'cultural cringe'. But that is rarely the case. There is a time to hold and a time to fold.

I vividly recall the wholesale buyup of California famland in the 1970's and '80s by 'the arabs with their petro-dollars' and the painful handwringing that ensued. The Arabs got the land, the locals the money. It was the end of the world as we know it. But nobody recalled those fears when farmland prices tanked and the Middle East investors sold out at distressed prices a few years later. The locals had the land back, and much of the money too.

Something similar may be going on in Australia; Australians have the money and the Chinese are holding a distressed asset. We tend to focus on the local losers, but there are winners too and many of them are locals. Reuters reports:

In 2006, foreign mining giants were jacking up prices of the iron ore needed by China's voracious steel industry. At the urging of Beijing, Yung and CITIC Pacific negotiated the rights to exploit a vast deposit of low-grade ore in the red-rock landscape of Australia's remote northwest Pilbara region.

The multibillion-dollar deal seemed to be a coup for China's resource-hungry economy. But Yung and Beijing are now paying a heavy price.

A few kilometres down a dirt track off the North West Coastal Highway, beside a towering pile of red tailings, the company has dug itself into what increasingly looks like a bottomless pit.

 

8. Caught in the crossfire - unintended consequence #87,374
There is no doubt that we want our banking system cleaned up of criminals. Everyone agrees. In the US the FDIC has issued new rules that require banks to fire people with criminal convictions, and banks there have been doing that.

The regulatory rules forbid the employment of anyone convicted of a crime involving dishonesty, breach of trust or money laundering. Not to fire such people risks huge fines and reputational damage. But some long-serving employees with teenage-prank convictions are being caught up in the move to tighter standards. Reuters reports:

Wells Fargo Home Mortgage has fired a Des Moines worker over a 1963 incident at a Laundromat involving a fake dime in the wake of new employment guidelines. Richard Eggers, 68, was fired in July from his job as a customer service representative for putting a cardboard cutout of a dime in a washing machine nearly 50 years ago in Carlisle, IA.

9. The cost of hunger
Food prices are racing higher; up 10% in July, according to the World Bank. Social unrest is the big worry. The severe drought in the US has been blamed for the rising prices of agricultural commodities. But that is only part of the story: Biofuels, financial speculation and changing dietary habits are also playing a role. The global food supply faces pressure from all sides. Spiegel Online has some useful insights about the real causes:

Many climatologists predict that in a warming world, heat waves like the one in the United States this year will become more frequent and more severe. In a new study, agricultural economists at New York's Columbia University predict that, if the climate models turn out to be true, extreme heat could reduce crop yields in the United States by about 30 percent.

The world must be prepared for the consequences of climate change varying greatly by region, with yields shrinking in some areas and growing in others. Regions of Scandinavia that were once cold and barren will likely turn into breadbaskets. The losers will include current centers of agricultural productivity like southern Spain. The vegetation belt in Africa will also shift, with the Sahara becoming greener and severe droughts becoming more common in the south.

10. Australia dry?
Finally today, a couple of charts showing recent variations from average. El Niño is coming (again, in its normal cycle).

 

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Remember we welcome robust, respectful and insightful debate. We don't welcome abusive or defamatory comments and will de-register those repeatedly making such comments. Our current comment policy is here.

76 Comments

German Constitutional Court hands down decision September 12th.

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FOMC meeting 12 September, announced 13, after German decision.

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By special arrangement Apple will release its iPhone 5 on 12 September. Gotta keep the peons happily distracted.

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Great Top 10 David.

Fascinating corn chart.Just 11% of US corn consumed by humans in US.

cheers

Bernard

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You mean directly in the US, the animal feed is indirect and the export will be most likely as human feed, the 39% biofuel is a concern

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Neven - correct. Corn-fed beef is still corn-fed humans, via Maccas.

 

I wonder how much biofuel went straight into the tractors too?

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http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=10831403

 

PDK, how do you like them apples?

 

Bet you humans find a solution to "peak oil"before the sky falls in.

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You miss the fact that they already didn't. Peak growth in humans was in 1961, been a downhill run from there not a "peak oil" solution in sight.

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So somehow we are going to deploy this worldwide and scale up renewables by many 1000% (based on the fact that one the largest renewable energy sources, wind contributes 2% to electricy production worldwide) and electricity is only one energy source

How do you like them apples?, can you see the zeros or are you physically blind as well?

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We should be harnessing the hot air which is produced in our parliament! I'm sure we could generate a few megawatts from what comes out of there ;-)

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F o'r.

 

You jest, surely.

 

I had a friend did his thesis on wave energy. Came to the conclusion - as do most - that it's not scalable, realistically. It would take mega infrastructure, is in a hostile environment, and if it indeed got to where wind is currently, would still be of no use at all. And - like wind - it only does electricity. Where's your plastics and bitument and fertilisers and transport coming from?

 

The time to have morphed (so as not to have to triage) was a long time ago. Any avenue should be pursued, but we shouldn't lose sight of the big picture.

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I jest, absolutely.

 

Was hoping for far more of a bite....

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Wow, Jeremy Grantham of GMO is an uber-bear on future food and resource availability!

 

Welcome to Dystopia - Entering a long-term and politically dangerous food crisis

http://www.gmo.com/websitecontent/GMOQ2Letter.pdf

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Corn outside the United States means any cereal crop, its meaning understood to vary geographically to refer to the local staple. In the United States, "corn" primarily means maize;[7] this usage started as a shortening of "Indian corn".[8] "Indian corn" primarily means maize (the staple grain of indigenous Americans), but can refer more specifically to multicolored "flint corn" used for decoration.[9]

Outside the U.S., the word corn often refers to maize in culinary contexts. The narrower meaning is usually indicated by some additional word, as insweet corncorn on the cobpopcorncorn flakesbaby corn.

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Who won the most medals at the Olympics? Europe..... Funny, don't recall seeing that flag up there, and try telling the French they didn't win as French persons....

 

Who has the largest economy in the world? Europe again....Funny, is it not also one of the most dsyfuntcional...? one of the most indebted...?

And where do most people want to go on holiday? Europe, of course.....Funny, maybe parts of it to revel in the culture of that particular ethnicity, and history...but the whole place...?Belgium...?...Frankfurt...?

 

On many measures of power, the European Union belongs with the United States and China in a global Big Three........Ok, ...no problem untill the Italians surrender before anything gets started, or the slavs used the EU guns to kill each other..... 

Yet say that to officials in Beijing, Washington or any other world capital today and they would probably laugh out loud......well, they shouldn't , as it's mean and naughty.

As European leaders stagger into yet another round of crisis summitry, this potential superpower is widely viewed as the sick man of the developed world............Your Problem here is one of  a German asking nationalities  within the Union to put aside their identies and the habits that go with those identities, to become a functioning part of a Master Power...cue evil laugh......Achtung Baby..! 

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http://wikitravel.org/en/Frankfurt

Germany is a great place to go on Holiday. Frankfurt looks very interesting. Germany cities are really good generally for a break, pretty, good transport, not too expensive very interesting places o see etc so I imagine that Frankfurt will have very high tourist numbers.

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I just knew if I hung it out there Plan B......good for you..! enjoy your holiday ,don't mention the war.

 P.S. I'm just waiting for Jean Claude Van Damme to come smack me around now, bloody Belgians , no sense of humour.

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Have you been to these places Christov?

Those rebulding Christchurch could do alot worse than attempting to copy the quality of planning, the efficiency and the retention of culture which German's cities have. They should visit Frankfurt, Hamburg, Berlin and Dusseldorf. They are nice cities and the people are exceedingly friendly. Transportation is not an issue, the cities are very clean and home to some of the most profitable companies in the world.

Belgium has the beautiful Brogue, with remarkable Winter markets. Well worth a visit. 

Its a shame most Kiwi's only go to UK, Ireland and the Med, if they go to German all they see is Octoberfest. The Aryan Nations have so much to offer..

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Yes goldenfox, and I agree they are places of engineering to be admired... and Yes I have.. loved the Airport at the big F..........I'm more of a Prague kind of guy...I just wish their women thought so...on that note I could have said Adelaide so a Sth Australian could give me the biffo.

 Look as I said to Plan B , just hanging it out there, fully expect to cop a paddling for being so mischievious.

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re 6: Build those things and literally millions of people are out of a job. Can China find ways to use that human resource? God knows everywhere in the developed West is failing at it. 

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Probably because we borrowed the funds  from offshore lenders to buy the asset in the first place.

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Mist42nz - we sell our assets to foreigners because most people do not know what an asset is. The same people don't seem to know what a liability is.  Government and its Agencies are a liability on private enterprise within NZ but you already know that.

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re1 - we presume this Prof doesn't quite grasp what Gareth Morgan stated recently: "If everyone currently on the planet, consumed resources at the rate the citizens of the USA do, we'd need 7 planets".  Unlikely the Prof's relative empire scenario will evolve as stated....

 

re2 -  Now we're getting to it. Well picked DC.  Although Kenneth Boulding got it a long time ago, and he was an economist....

 

re 6 - Benwave hits the nail on the head.

 

re10 - the interesting thing is the rate of change adjacent to the Antarctic. The ability - capacitance - of the oceans to absorb is just about done now, so look to that to accelerate. Folk need to understand what happens when you increase the energy in weather systems - you get more extreme events. Ignorance suggests you should get more sunny days, whereas what you get is more powerful weather systems.

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http://www.thepoliticalscientist.org/?p=937 - comment-4997

Thank you for linking to such a great article. National have no interest at all in Free Markets and competition. Again and again National seem focused on the needs of insiders, party members , party paymasters and associated interests.  Christchurch  is Disaster Capitalism at its finest.

Rule 1. Let the locals rot. Leave them so long in limbo that they will agree to almost anything. The only question for National is - did they leave things long enough to get the result they want or has our three year electoral cycle forced their hand?

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Are you sure emporer gerry is just following orders?  I always thought he was a towering intellect of the national party.

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Equal rights as long as you are white eh? While all very nice to write off the treaty, the trouble is that any constitution would have to be written according to Maori law and customs since this is already preserved the Constitution Act 1852. You are better than that SL.

 

Check my post over on the asset sale article, to give away native rights is to give away the rule of law. 

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Following the declaration of 1835 Maori then clarified their thinking in the 1840 Treaty where they handed over sovereignty to a single government and received full rights and citizenship in return.  What a great deal for Maori.  You really need to read these documents fully Scarfie. 

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So did you all of a sudden become an expert on the translation of Maori language did you KH.  You now comprehend why the two translations don't match and why the Privy Council have decided in favour of the Maori version and what Maori believed they were signing into. But your esteemed wisdom and critical thinking are far superior to that of the Privy Council or Court of Appeal. Heck we are lucky to have you here.

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So I take it you haven't read them ?

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Have YOU read the version put together by Professor Margaret Mutu, a linguistics expert? Reading them won't do you any good in isolation either KH.

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You didn't respond when asked to repudiate apartheid Scarfie.  And are still not answering todays question. 

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It is not an issue of race it is a question of land rights. But I don't expect you are smart enough to see that with your superficial look at this issue. Do some reading and dig deeper, otherwise you are just being a troll.

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Not a question of race Scarfie?  Have you looked back at your past posts.  You specialise in that subject. 

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Yes the problem was arrogant pricks arriving here to colonise this fine country and overiding the land rights of the occupants by all sorts of dishonest means. The courts have said that the methods used were illegal. The arrogant pricks are still in charge, and more keep arriving, so the fraud continues. 

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Yep, quite right Mr Scarfie. The Chinese have a lot to answer for.

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If the arrogant pricks are still in charge they must live for a long time eh. Ancient Arrogant Pricks among us....scary thoughts.

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If you are too stupid to understand that it is an issue of the rule of law in regard to property rights, why don't you just say so. Oh wait....you already did.

 

The only reason that native land rights have not been correctly addressed for 170 years is because people are too stupid to realise that their own property rights can be undermined in the blink of a ministers eye. Head in the sand stuff.

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not stupid. people just dont know. I dont even know but I assume that everyone is a tenant in the land. Apartently countries like the US is different, but I haven't looked into it.

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It is okay not to know, the problem is when people make uninformed comment :-) I think Mist is closer to the truth in regarnds to land in NZ, although if you are sitting on land the Maori didn't willingly dispose on then it could be more vulnerable. The presumption in NZ though is that people hold freehold title and that this is protected by the rule of law. Mist points out this is not true, and the real issue is that Maori have been denied the rule of law for 170 years despite the treaty guaranteeing this right as British (then NZ)subjects. Just hope your land is wanted for a highway or military installation.

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I hope scarfie that you didnt mean that our ex leaders in charge were pricks too? Like perhaps the lady's in red Clark and Wilson ?

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You have missed a few bits out in your history.  For example the Treaty wasn't signed by all iwi.  Oh and the Crown made declarations about cancelling land purchases before any treaty was signed (e.g. Hobson's speech in Christ Church, Kororareka on 30 Jaunary 1940) which suggest they "assumed" sovereignty before any treaty was signed.  The 1835 declaration was northland/bay of islands thing, not all of the country.  Then there is the problem that the english and maori verisons of the treaty are different.

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Scarfie has reverted to abuse Andrew.  As is usual when the mixture of racist illogic and wanabe legalism doesn't add up.  So don't expect too much.

And reference to the 'Treaty'  should include a read which Scarfie should do with an uncluttered mind.  Sovreignty was invested in the crown and Maori gained citizenship.  Any amount of recreating the story don't change it.

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Maori property rights are based on the treaty and aboriginal title of a wide ranging hunter gathering society before colonisation by an agricultural society. This is an unjust justice where Maori can claim the foreshore and seabed, rivers, lakes, mountains, oil, gas. NZ was the last corner on earth to be settled from the other side of the world. What principle is it that says this is the way it should be scarfie, given the current thinking (Rio Summit) that the commons are owned by everyone and no one? Your position is that there is no commons in NZ: it is all Maori land.

Is it that Maori have their own world view (a seperate reality) where such things don't apply?

Ever read the Merchant of Venice Scarfie? Shylock is awarded his pound of flesh but Portia decrees he must not draw any blood. That is a good analogy for the Maori position.

Btw Professor Mutu's mother was born in Scotland.

Tariana Turias father was an American soldier.

etc

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Interesting view on Chinese thinking re dairy industry

"If China's dairy producers could establish their own raw milk bases and form an integrated production chain, they could not only ensure the quality of their dairy products but also reduce production costs," Ma said.

The price of domestic raw milk is 35,000 yuan per ton while the price of imported raw milk from New Zealand is between 23,000 yuan and 24,000 yuan per ton, Southern Metropolis Daily reported Sunday, citing Guo Benheng, CEO of Bright Dairy & Food Co.

In 2010 Bright Dairy acquired Synlait Milk Limited, a raw milk base in New Zealand, with the production capacity of 100,000 tons, equal to annual demand of raw milk by the company, the newspaper said.

"I recommended other Chinese dairy producers to acquire overseas raw milk bases as the establishment of a milk supply base needs at least eight to 10 years and a lot of experience," Ma said

http://www.globaltimes.cn/content/729216.shtml

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Don't let it happen. Learn from the mistakes of others. Don't get too comfortable

Here is what is happening in Australia
http://www.smh.com.au/business/chinese-buy-up-big-in-australia-20120902-258cq.html

But, that's benign and unremarkable unless you read it in the context of the following

Last week I posted a comment about the 3 Big Foreign National Miners and how they shift all their proceeds offshore. Now in the following article by Michael West you can see how much tax they DON'T pay, in fact they get massive GST clawbacks .. they pay little tax, in fact they have TAX CREDITS and they are 3 of the biggest businesses in Australia ..
http://www.smh.com.au/business/as-miners-the-big-three-take-tumbles-but-as-tax-lobbyists--20120831-255w3.html

The significance of that does not go un-noticed by the new arrivals .. and thats what's in store ...

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It should be one rule for all, not one rule for some. 

 

Therein lies the problem SL, there hasn't been one rule for all for over 150 years yet this was something guaranteed under the treaty. The problem deeper that you are looking. It is a problem with the governance of this country and the cosy relationship that the legislature and exective have, and the power they do as the please. I am surprised at you not seeing this, because I think you have the ability to.

Basically by deny the rights of Maori guaranteed to them under the treaty you are making a choice between democracy and the rule of law. By doing this you can't have both. So you are in fact saying you are in favour of a new constitition and a new democracy, but don't want these underpinned by the rule of law because you are throwing that away. Dangerous territory my friend.

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People who do understand (ie: you!) ...

David you big tease.

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This guy is really impressive

 

Professor Bartlett has given his celebrated one-hour lecture, Arithmetic, Population and Energy: Sustainability 101 over 1,600 times to audiences with an average attendance of 80 in the United States and world-wide. His audiences have ranged from junior high school and college students to corporate executives and scientists, and to congressional staffs.

He first gave the talk in September, 1969, and subsequently has presented it an average of once every 8.5 days for 36 years. His talk is based on his paper,Forgotten Fundamentals of the Energy Crisis, originally published in the American Journal of Physics, and revised in the Journal of Geological Education.

Professor Al Bartlett begins his one-hour talk with the statement, The greatest shortcoming of the human race is our inability to understand the exponential function.

He then gives a basic introduction to the arithmetic of steady growth, including an explanation of the concept of doubling time. He explains the impact of unending steady growth on the population of Boulder, of Colorado, and of the world.

He then examines the consequences steady growth in a finite environment and observes this growth as applied to fossil fuel consumption, the lifetimes of which are much shorter than the optimistic figures most often quoted.

He proceeds to examine oddly reassuring statements from experts, the media and political leaders – statements that are dramatically inconsistent with the facts. He discusses the widespread worship of economic growth and population growth in western society.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/arithmetic-population-and-energy-lecture/

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Spot on JH.

If only everyone of voting age in the developed world could be persuaded to watch Dr Bartlett's presentation. It's been seen by over 5,000,000 in its various mainfestations on YouTube, but that's not enough.

That video is a key to understanding the inextricable links between population increase, the resource crunch, the lunatic growth and debt-based economic system, increasing energy consumption, and climate change denial.

I'm sure most lurkers here understand the exponential function (or did once upon a time) but Dr Bartlett's presentation is still important because he shines a light on the absurdity of our current path, the implications of even small degrees of growth, and the phenomenal ignorance and stupidity of those in charge.

Also interesting is Dr Tom Murphy's "Do the Math" site. He extrapolates our growth of energy use over the last couple of millennia (remarkably close to a straight line on a logarithmic scale) and concludes that we'll consume the entire output of the sun in 400 years and a galaxy's worth in 2500 years.

http://physics.ucsd.edu/do-the-math/2011/07/galactic-scale-energy/

Good luck with that.

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ho hum. next person who is over 30 years old, has kids, uses energy and says that everyone else doesn't understand the expodential function don't understand the word 'hypocritical'  

 

hypocritical |ˌhipəˈkritikəl|

 

• behaving in a way that suggests one has higher standards or more noble beliefs than is the case

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I don't follow your logic.

If I got it wrong does that mean that I shouldn't change my ways and that everybody else unto the nth generation should follow me down the gurgler?

Does that mean that the 6.5 billion people outside the USA and Australasia should aspire to consuming at our rate?

Is there no room in your philosophy for learning from the mistakes of others?

Should we all just abandon hope and party up?

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I listen to the westerners who moved into the delhi slums way more than the moral high grounders living in a way that belies their teachings. If they cant live like the way they say everyone else should what authority do they hold.

 

I dont have answers for you, remember that others interperate your ideas differently, they might say that anyone over a certain age has to go because they ruin it for others.   do you want that?

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I don't think people need to 'remove themselves from the gene pool', just limit the amount of progeny to ~2 children. Instead, we still have people popping out 4+ kids per family which is a sure way to overpopulate the planet (as we have witnessed over the last 100 years).

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I think you can have my complete asshole award of the day.

congrats

 

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...... bloody sad when you have to give it away , to someone else ...... you'll get the award back tomorrow , steven ....... Gummy has faith in you !

regards

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Ah well GBH, never mind you arent bright enough to win it....by a long way.

regards

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So very true ! ... ..sadly for the Gummster , I can only dream of being as deserving as you are steven , of that particular award ...... you are a legend , my friend !

regards

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A blog worth following:

The Economic Collapse

  • "By the end of Obama's first term, the U.S. national debt will have grown more than it did from the time that George Washington became president to the time that George W. Bush became president. "
  • "At this point, the U.S. national debt is more than 22 times larger than it was when Jimmy Carter became president."

It's gonna be a rough ride.

And the reason for the whole mess is here:

Where does money come from?

Or here as animated movies:

How the money manipulators are destroying everything

 

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size isn't imporant, percentage is. Have a look at private debt. its much much bigger than public debt

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But the private debt has asset backing. The public debt not so much.

I saw recently that the Fed's asset to liability ratio has gone from 1:21 to 1:51 since the meltdown. The Fed's assets are a miniscule $50,000,000,000. 

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Can you show me the asset backing?

 

regards

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I was afraid someone would ask.

:)

I'll start tracking my muddy footprints and report back.

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thanks!

US public debt can always be paid back thru inflation/debasement and raising taxes.  It'srock solid debt.

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Just like ours.

When we're not stealing from our grandchildren we're diluting the wealth of the prudent. It's a great system.

As a retiree relying on interest income and the Armed Forces Super Fund that fills me with joy and delight.

Got a spare 3 hours?

"Do you not know, my son, with how little wisdom the world is governed?"

Count Axel Gustafsson Oxenstierna af Södermöre 350 years ago. 

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

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not exactly like ours. The US debt is in US dollars. The NZ debt isn't in New Zealand dollars.

 

The US can print its way out of debt, NZ can't.

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Good old Chrome History.

Some scary numbers here. Especially for the Brits.

Here you are.

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thanks - I didn't see the private debt asset backing in there. Can you point it out?

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That was a figment of my own dementia.

Apart from periodic bubble bursts private debt holds up better than central bank ephemera.

:)

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The problem isnt the Fed, the problem is the crony capitalism and private debt...

Cherry picking data to justify your argument isnt going to cut it, try adding in the debt GW Bush piled on....and the state he left the Nation/world for Obama to pick up.

The USA is a banana republic with nukes.....and its life style isnt up for negoitiation, try putting 2 and 2 together.

regards

 

 

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I'm not cherry picking. They're all guilty. But Obama promised change. He inspired hope and then before he even took office he appointed the foxes to run the henhouse. He borrowed up large to pay off the evildoers, he let the victiims lose their jobs and their homes and now he's expecting those victims and their descendants to pay the tab.

 

About all you can say for Obama right now is that he's not as frightenly away-with-the-fairies as Romney and his even more scary running mate.

 

Hope is thin on the ground right now.

 

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Hi,

Thanks for clarifying, yes I agree.....mega disappointed with Obama....while I can see him as a possum in the headlights, if he couldnt do it no one can.

Romney - LOL....yes.....fairies, well described....LOL.

However roughly 50% of the US voting population will vote for him.  I honestly wonder if him getting in wouldnt be the better outcome for us long term.....the result of his and ryan's mis-management might just open the ppls eyes. If they dont nothing will, 4 more years of tread water hoping for better Obama isnt going to work...

regards

 

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 "I honestly wonder if him getting in wouldnt be the better outcome for us long term..."

I've been thinking that too. The sooner it all hits the fan, the less the ultimate mess.

Go Mitt!

"50% of the US voting population will vote for him"

And they voted for W too - twice!

I saw a recent estimate that 1-2% of actual voters decide the US election, and that that number of votes can be bought for about one billion dollars.

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Great thing about Romney having Ryan on board is if they win there is no uh excuses, their two "best" um....minds were at the helm. Although Im sure they'll blame the Greater Depression on 4 years of Obama's mis-management.

The swing vote...and that applies here in NZ though the % looks bigger, 10% maybe but just as easily bribed.

regards

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Unless I'm Gummfuddled again , isn't today the second anniversary of the first Christchurch earthquake , the 7.1 rock & roll ......

 

...... 11 000 'shakes later  , they still keep trembling .....

 

Thought of the day : Salute the long suffering residents of Christchurch City !

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You are gumdiddlyright Bear. Just took me back to the horrible event, I mistook the quake for the end of the world a year ago in Chch. Terrible! Amanda is standing for the salute as well.

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SL - there's those who stand up and talk and make promises and then excuses. Then there are those who just get on with the job.  Its the workers fixing the roads, the builders repairing and rebuilding, the deconstructing teams knocking everything over, the drainlayers and plumbers and every other person actively engaged in productive work who are rebuilding the city.  Last time I looked all those standing up, talking and promising and making excuses wouldn't know sh^t from clay if they were standing in it.

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