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Chris Hipkins went on the offensive in the Newshub leaders debate as he tried to win back some lost support in the polls

Public Policy / opinion
Chris Hipkins went on the offensive in the Newshub leaders debate as he tried to win back some lost support in the polls
Chris Hipkins and Christopher Luxon launch their election campaigns in Auckland
Chris Hipkins and Christopher Luxon launch their election campaigns in Auckland

Labour leader Chris Hipkins sought to shake loose some of the voters the National Party has picked up with repeated attacks on his rival, during the Newshub debate on Wednesday.  

At times it was almost ugly, with Hipkins going after Luxon over his integrity, willingness to work with New Zealand First, and his party’s previous record.

Some hits landed, while others didn’t. National not having a publically released fiscal plan to back up its promises left an open goal and Hipkins took the shot.

“You promised you’d have your fiscal plan out before voting started. If you can't keep your promises in opposition, why would we trust you to keep them in Government,” he asked. 

With Labour way behind in the polls, Hipkins chose to challenge Luxon over almost every question and answer. 

But sometimes these attacks fell flat. When the leaders were asked what they would do for rainbow youth, who have a shockingly high rate of suicide, Luxon had an answer. 

A newly created Minister for Mental Health would be responsible for working with those communities to bring down those rates. 

Hipkins tried to attack, saying being rainbow wasn’t a mental health problem and attempting to paint Luxon as an out of touch conservative. 

But when pushed by the moderator, Hipkins had no real answer to the actual problem and the whole thing backfired.

Another National’s weakness is the possibility of having to rely on New Zealand First to help it form government. Here Luxon was shaky. 

When asked about Winston Peters, the National Party leader said he didn’t even know him. 

The moderator also asked whether Peters or Judith Collins would make a better Minister of Foreign Affairs. Luxon said he didn’t know.

Another zinger from Hipkins: “You do know she’s the one on your team, right?” 

It’s unlikely that this debate will move the polls and calling a winner is a mugs game, but Hipkins walked off that stage looking a little stronger than he went in. 

It's hard to say the same for Luxon, but voters might not see it that way — or even see it at all.

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160 Comments

Looked desperate from Hipkins, someone give him a hug...

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16

I thought he looked like a man who knows he is gonna go out so he may as well go out swinging. He will still lose but exposed Luxon and National's policies for the lightweights they are.

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49

we are heading for a cliff, no matter what he will deliver tax cuts but has no idea how to pay for it , hopefully winston stops him raising GST 

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21

I expect to see NZF to keep rising. I get the feeling the populace knows it will be a Nat/Act Govt and are countering this by putting Winston in as a gatekeeper. Now he's over 5% they know the vote will count.

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20

Yep that direction, outcome  looks bedded in now. Assisted quite some by ACT’s over acting. Might be NZF & ACT end up not that far away from one another in representation.

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13

He knows that deep down but he has to hang in there until the last minute. I can tell in his eyes that he wants out already.

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1

The audience seemed to laugh and clap in derision at many of Luxon's lapses. Does it mean anything ?

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3

Six years of Hipkins & Co. The slide is well down the slippery slope now. Hard to defy gravity, least of all in politics. The attack dog is always the last desperate hand of any politician. Some sympathy though. Hipkins assumed command of a stricken ship nigh on the rocks. Of course the previous PM at the helm for 85% of the voyage, charted the course but abandoned ship in good order and with dame hood in celebration . A contribution that looks likely to have set the New Zealand Labour Party right back into the boondocks  of 2008.

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34

i think it time for the left to prepare for the next election,  if we thought the government is bad now watch the next three years, a leader that is all slogans, a finance minister that can not count, a grumpy old man and a grumpy younger man at the cabinet table shaking fists at each other , some bad new ministers that have no idea on how governments work and failing in short order, and i would suspect a leadership change for national and infighting as things fall apart in the second year

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41

Hahaha delusion

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12

Lol share trader, a finance minister that cannot count. And yet you seem to believe that Robertson, a financial illiterate, can? How about spending more than you earn? How about printing money by the billions and creating rampant inflation? How about promising to keep spending under 30% of GDP? How'd that go? How about their latest bollocks - operating expenditure in 2024 to be $3.5b, 2025 $3.25 the year following and $3b in the two subsequent years. Yet the have spent 2020 $4.8b, 2021 $5.9b, and 2022 $4.8b. And somehow, with all their additional expenditure they are expecting to do, they will reduce spending? How about that bridge I have that you can buy? Oh, and by the way, how are the ram raids and assaults going in your town? How about waiting at A&E? How about attendance and achievements of kids at school? How are they doing? 

One last question, how many hospitals have Labour built in their current term? Just as a compare and contrast, National built 2 in their last term.

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19

Which new hospitals did National build?  

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9

Robertson was a terrible finance minister and will go down as one of the worst in history BUT normally you replace bad with someone better not  just  equally as bad

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4

Lol sharetrader, nice work, you are calling Willis worse before she's even started. I'm sure you said the same about Robertson before he started. Or not....

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4

Willis 100% supported the Medium Density Residentials Standards (MDRS).

Now she's done a 180 degree about face.

Trustworthy? Competent? I think not.

Vote for her if you like.

Sadly, she'll be exposed in no time. Sad. Her heart is sometime in the right place but as MoF she's hopelessly out of her depth.

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4

Indeed. The next three years will be a poison chalice for the "winner", although there's virtually unlimited permanent damage to our quality of life waiting to be unleashed by the clueless twats seeking permission from a dumbed and self interested public. Mass immigration, blah, blah, find more oil and gas to burn, blah, blah, incinerate rubbish because we are too lazy to cut it's production, blah blah, introduce synthetic organisms into our environment because the answer to the problem of over industrialism is more industrialism, blah blah, new airport, blah, more tourists blah, more sprawl blah........ NZ will be unrecognisable in three years, unless the coming resource squeeze can rescue us from ourselves. It's almost worth giving the potato party a crack, just to see the thrashing about as it falls apart, and it will.

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11

And Sharetrader, here is the wall of shame for Robertson and Labour (if you can bare to read it all without wretching). And to think that Labour and their supporters had a cow over Key spending $24m on a flag referendum. All this courtesy of Alex Holland (and sorry about the box crap, this is a cut and paste job):

In 2017 when Labour came to power, crown spending was $76 billion per year. Now in 2023 it is $139 billion per year, which equates to a $63 billion annual increase (over $1 billion extra spend every week!) In 2017, NZ’s government debt stood at $112 billion. Today, excluding an accounting trick, that debt is now doubled at $224 billion or $115,000 per household. Meanwhile, in 2017 individual tax payers paid the government $33 billion. By 2023 this had gone up 67% to $55 billion to help fund Labours spending. Here is just some of the wasted spending (which most media swept under the carpet): 

  • $2.75 million handed over to the Mongrel Mob to run a meth rehab programme. More than $100,000 of it spent on hiring a van, $239,400 spent on food & catering, $157,500 for Marae hire.
  • Arts, Culture and Heritage Minister Carmel Sepuloni husband, Daren Kamali, received $73,000 towards the Ulu Cavu Wig Tour of New Zealand. The project involved harvesting his 25-year-old dreadlocks to make a ceremonial wig in the ancient Fijian tradition.
  • $107,280 in taxpayer money given to a racist stage show about murdering James Cook, his descendants and ‘white men like [him] with pig hunting knives’; ironically at the same time trying to stop ‘hate speech’.
  • $150,000 tax payer dollars for altering gang members’ tattoos to be more ‘Woke’ – e.g. removing ‘New Zealand’ and replacing with ‘Aotearoa’.
  • $51 million investigating the Boomer Bike Bridge to Birkenhead then scrapped it.
  • $21.6 million on the scrapped Income Insurance scheme.
  • $20 million on the scrapped TVNZ RNZ merger.
  • $800,000 on the scrapped hate speech laws.
  • $21 million on consultants just for Te Whatu Ora.
  • $21 million on consultants just for Te Pukenga.
  • $2.2 million on Maori Health Authority PR alone.
  • $72 million on Auckland light rail before anything actually physically done, $47m on consultants alone.
  • $12 million to provide farmer-to-farmer support to Māori landowners to milk sheep.
  • Ministry of Education spent $100,000 on wellbeing website then scrapped it as another new one replaces it.
  • Te Aka Whai Ora (Māori Health Authority) has spent an eye-watering $1,000,000 on their new Aroā Wellbeing website that invites users to ‘scroll through the forest' to ‘cleanse', ‘breathe' and ‘connect'. While $300,000 was spent on the website's design and creation, the Ministry could not provide the detail of how the remaining $700,000 was allocated as it did “not hold information on breakdown of costs into areas such as music, voice actors, and graphic design.”
  • Taxpayers shelled out $11,742.31 transporting a dead turtle from Banks Peninsula to Wellington, storing it in a freezer for 21 months, then sending it back down to where it washed up for a high-powered and fully-catered powhiri, complete with a helicopter ride and a handmade coffin constructed by public servants. No scientific research was performed at any stage.
  • Auckland Transport builds $32,000 bus stop on Great Barrier Island with no public transport. It also needed to be relocated due to safety concerns.
  • Taliban praise New Zealand Labour government over $3 million ‘humanitarian’ donation.
  • Ministry of Social Development ran virtual job expos at a cost of $835,000 with only 126 attendees over 2 years – that’s $6626 per person.
  • Wallaby eradicating programme cost over $2.7 million, more than 26,000 hours of labour with only 18 Wallabies killed = $153,000 per Wallaby! Cheaper to hire a private jet per Wallaby to send back to Australia.
  • When this Labour government took over, the spend on emergency housing was $11 million per year, now it is over $365 million per year.
  • Campaign by Labour to have shorter showers cost the tax payer $2.8 million dollars including distributing a booklet in 7 different languages.
  • August 2023: The Covid wage subsidy is still being paid out by Labour on behalf of the tax payer to companies whose employee’s test positive and are isolating for 7 days.
  • $160 million worth of RAT tests paid by the tax payer to be thrown out. January 2022 – April 2023 = $44.27 million just to store Covid 19 PPE & RAT test warehousing. Pre 2022 Labour has no idea of what the costs were. $531 million worth of rapid antigen tests (RATs) still in stock with most unlikely to be used when private businesses could have purchased these and controlled minimal wastage. The cost to store these unused RAT tests is $100,000 per day.
  • $842,000 tax payer funds to research the experiences of ethnic women as politicians within NZs political systems.
  • January 2023: The ongoing rent for an immigration office in China closed more than a year ago has cost NZ taxpayers almost $3 million. Last year, the government wrote off $284 million of losses sustained by Immigration New Zealand (INZ), and has put visa levies up by 279 percent.
  • Labour have spent $10,000 tax payer dollars promoting Australian citizenship to Kiwis living in Australia.
  • Film Commission decided to give the American producers of the kids show ‘Power Rangers’ $1.6 million of our money just to include reference to a NZ Pavlova in one of its episodes.
  • Rod Steward was funded $918,000 by Tourism NZ for a single lip synced pre-recorded video of his song ‘Sailing’ during the Americas cup. He did not appear in person or cross live.
  • 3 weeks before cancelling the Bike Bridge to Birkenhead, Labour government leased 1092m3 of office space in Wynyard quarter Auckland CBD (some of the most expense office space in Auckland) to manage this canned project at a cost of approx. $500,000 which sat empty for almost a year.
  • Te Huia Hamilton-Auckland train – cost $98 million and losing money every time it runs. It is slower than taking a car and produces more emissions per person than a car, then it was banned from Auckland city after twice failing to stop on red.
  • $438 million from a ‘range’ of crown funds including from the Covid funds to do up 358 privately owned buildings (Marae).
  • $582,000 on a kid's slide outside Parliament.
  • Kāinga Ora's spent $24,354,759 of taxpayer money over the past four years on itself on office renovations. While Kāinga Ora spends millions on itself, it admitted in its 2022 annual report just 21 percent of its homes met the Healthy Homes Standards – meaning 54,000 homes failed. While 25,000 on Kāinga Ora's waitlist currently without a house.
  • The Department of Internal Affairs spent $1.36 million on furniture in a year where few of its staff were even in the office! ($700 for every staff member).
  • The new $26 million visitor centre for Punakaiki rocks built then given away to private owners.
  • September 2023: Auckland Light Rail has contracted to buy the prominent Kiwi Bacon Building for $33 million, even though National has promised to scrap plans if elected in a few weeks’ time. Labour is continuing without a business case and without a confirmed route, spending $2 million dollars in consultancy fees each week.
  • Total core crown expenses planned by Labour over next 4 years is forecast to be $578 billion, so the announcement by Labour to save $4 billion over next 4 years by reducing their massively inflated spend on contractors amounts to just 0.7% savings. When taking into account that $274 billion of that $578 billion is increased extra spend by this Labour government compared to when they came into power, then the $4 billion savings over the next 4 years amounts to only 1.5% reduction on the $274 increase they implemented.
  • Under Labour, now double the number of civil servants getting over $400,000 per year.
  • Labour government spent millions on foreign advertising campaigns promoting tourism to NZ when the PM has closed the borders to tourists from March 2020 for 2 years.
  • MSD paid exorbitant sums of $2000-$3000 per week for private rental properties for use as emergency accommodation, when the median rent that would typically have been paid for those properties was between $450 and $560 a week.
  • Kainga Ora unpaid rents under National government sat at about $750,000, under Labour it is $17 million, quadrupling just in the last 3 years – this is unrecoverable debt that the tax payer has to pay.
  • Kainga Ora management positions have ballooned by 86% in 2 years. Annual cost of the base salary now tops $100 million. They employed 319 managers in June of 2020 @ $58 million and in November 2022 they have 594 managers @ $103 million. Average salary is $173,000 base pay – ignoring purposive pay freeze.
  • $600,000 on a 30 second ad telling people to save energy, despite record energy prices.
  • Labour has a program for Kāinga Ora to borrow $2 billion to bid against private developers – paying over value to obtain land to build state houses on rather than letting private sector do it.
  • Over half a billion dollars given to Maori to go and get the free Covid vaccine (that no one else seemed to have an issue getting). When only a third of Maori children were vaccinated, they spent some of the money on buying candy floss, ice cream, hot dogs, thick shakes etc to entice them to get vaccinated, but rubbish food goes against being healthy during a pandemic. At the same time, Iwi are complaining about the Maori obesity rate and require special race-based funding for that.
  • Labour removed National’s public service targets in 2018, and since then has employed 14,000 extra public servants costing $1.7 billion with no discernible positive outcomes. 28% public sector increase while best performing countries perform with up to 49% less public servants. In 2017, the Ministry of Education had 2632 bureaucrats for 2550 schools. Now there are 3900+, and we don’t know what they do. Ministry of Education bureaucrats have increased 50% under Labour while front line staff (teachers) have only increased 4%.
  • Hastings' most expensive house sold in 2022 for $1.6 million, now used to house three teenagers for Oranga Tamariki. It was the largest price paid for a house in the city of Hastings, where the average price for a residential house was $784,000. The Crown also purchased an adjoining vacant property for $700,000 to turn into a vegetable garden and put a trampoline on. A neighbour said the cost of purchasing the properties ($2.3 million) and the subsequent four-months of renovation seemed enormous. If they’d shopped around, they’d have got three or four houses for that money and would have been able to house three or four times the people.
  • 3 waters advertising campaign – Ardern’s administration found itself in hot water with the Public Service Commission over its ‘inappropriate’ use of taxpayer money on a $3.5 million advertisement campaign to convince ratepayers of the benefits of its widely controversial Three Waters reforms, a review deeming the absence of factual information and ‘misleading’ exaggeration, ‘concerning’.
  • MIQ didn’t have to be pre-paid, so now chasing many that was never paid and don’t even know some of the people’s details to chase them (chasing & debt collectors also at cost of tax payer). Taxpayers have spent $1.2 billion on MIQ – $660 for every household in the country.
  • $49,999 towards an Indigenised Hypno-soundscape to take you to the ‘imagined worlds of our Korero Purakau’.
  • 20 per cent of commercial spectrum given to Māori that could have been sold, a permanent Māori spectrum entity to be established and $75 million of government funding will go towards development.
  • Annual spend of $34 million to ‘enhance Te Reo’.
  • $139 million gun buyback resulting in gun crime soaring as gangs still have the guns. Administering the scheme will cost $35 million, almost double what was budgeted. The extra money will come out of the budget for community policing. “The Auditor-General was unable to determine if New Zealanders were any safer as a result of the Government’s gun buyback scheme.”
  • $55 million fund for media to follow the governments agenda. In any other country, this would be considered government interference in the fourth estate.
  • Minister of Arts, Culture & Heritage (Jacinda at the time) approved $18,000 to create and develop an online publication, arts learning resources and musical content based on children’s drag theatre show ‘The Glitter Garden’.
  • Housing agency under fire for $30,000 spent on a carving.
  • Tax payer funded ACC ads on radio saying think before going for a bike ride as you might hurt yourself.
  • Labour wrecked an industry on a Captain’s Call (oil & gas) and then presided over the largest imports of dirty coal we have ever seen, into a country that is sitting on huge coal reserves.
  • Mental health sector struggling to get funding but Arts and culture sector gets huge Govt funding boost. The Cultural Sector Emergency Relief Fund has also been provided an additional $35.5 million to fund more direct support for individuals and organisations. The limit on funding for individual organisations has been increased from $100,000 to $300,000.
  • By February 2022, the government home ownership scheme housed just 58 families in 19 months.
  • 37,000 more kids are in benefit-dependent homes than when Labour’s government began 4 years ago.
  • Giving away most of NZ's first purchased Covid vaccines to other countries for free (Pacific Islands).
  • Sport NZ has spent $4.7 million conducting surveys in the last four years (up to March 2022), interrogating New Zealanders on what kind of physical activity they do, how often, and for how long. Obsessively tracking New Zealanders' participation in yoga, gardening, and tramping may be a fun statistical exercise, but it hardly seems like a priority during a cost of living crisis.
  • Labour spent $200,000 on social media listening reports – what people say online (spying on the public). They refuse to make the reports public or methodology used, 52 reports year to March 2022.
  • In Feb 2017 there were 67,000 people on a ‘Work Ready’ benefit, at Feb 2021 that figure had doubled to over 130,000 – at the same time Labour are claiming a low unemployment rate.
  • $32 million measles vaccine rollout only reached a mere 7 per cent of the targeted number of people putting the cost at $1300 per person. Labour was forced to destroy $8 million worth of expired measles vaccine due to their inability to manage vaccine demand. $3 million went towards ‘equity group' but only 28 kids in Tairawhiti vaccinated in those 2 years of the campaign.
  • 2022 NZTA putting up fees on average 40% in one go, getting nothing more back from it – in affect a new tax.
  • New Zealand taxpayers are now spending $151,000 per prisoner, per year – an increase of over $30,000 per prisoner from 2018/19. Overall, there has been an increase of $139 million poured into the Corrections system over the period between 2018/19 and 2020/21, despite Labour reducing prisoner numbers.
  • National said each job created by the Provincial Growth Fund was costing the taxpayer $484,000 – that’s nearly half a million dollars.
  • The Ministry for Pacific Peoples spent $260,000 on catering last year despite only having 127 staff members – that is over $2000 per staff member. In 2017, they had just 35 staff.
  • The Ministry for Pacific Peoples spent $40,000 on a leaving event including $7,500 worth of gifts for Mr Leauanae who was moving down the road to become CEO of the Ministry of Culture and Heritage. Then the Ministry of Culture and Heritage held a welcoming party and flew 5 of his family in to celebrate him starting the new job.
  • The Ministry for Pacific Peoples spent $121,000 on Prezzy cards for pregnant Pacific Women to go to the doctor. The Ministry has no outputs other than gross expenditure. They have 9 press staff and zero press releases in the 2021/22 year.
  • The Ministry for Pacific Peoples spent $52,587.76 of taxpayer money on Budget breakfast events.
  • The Ministry for Pacific Peoples expenditure has risen 477% in the past 5 years, including the number of people earning over $100,000 increasing from 29.3% to 65%.
  • After all the lockdowns & billions spent, Covid deaths per million in NZ on a 7 day rolling average was higher than USA (as at 30/3/22).
  • While hospitals are failing and over $1 million dollars is spent on emergency housing (motels) every day, Covid Response Grant funds were spent on anything & everything including:
  • Atawhai Interactive Tapui, which received $250,000 towards production of Toroa, that gives tamariki and rangatahi an experience to fly as Toroa on its journey from the Pacific Ocean back to its home on Taiaroa head. It will explore the themes of whakapapa as the Toroa soars over the ocean, deified as Takaroa, on the winds of Tāwhirimatea.
  • $1,323,000 Taki Rua Productions – The development and delivery of two immersive live productions of large-scale contemporary Māori performing arts pieces.
  • $1,015,300 Māori land Charitable Trust to deliver Purita, a capability system to enable identification and development of Māori potential.
  • $700,000 on a “digital storytelling experience” about the ManawatÅ« River.
  • $248,460 on traditional Māori painting.
  • $20,000 Te RÅ«naka o Ōtākou scoping the use of a web platform to leverage pÅ«rākau [myths and legends], and traditional and contemporary technologies to connect with the Ōtākou diaspora.
  • $20,000 on a business plan for Tongan mat-weaving.
  • $20,000 To develop a business plan for virtual reality recreations of current Māori wāhi tapu [sacred places] with an initial focus on Kāi Tahu marae and their historic sites of interest.
  • $20,000 To contribute to the creation of a te reo Māori children’s book which uses an app to embellish the story with music and claymation videos, and allows the reader to recreate waiata using instrumental loops.
  • Energy Efficiency & Conservation authority spending $2.4 million to encourage people to ‘use less power’, running ads that cost $11,000 per second. Government wasteful spending of taxpayer funds during times of highest inflation in 30 years.
  • As at April 2022, Waka Kotahi spending $200-400,000 on temporary fences each time there is a cycling race over the Harbour bridge – 5 events over following 10 months costing 1-2 million dollars in sunken funds for no long-term benefit. Why not just have cycle races that don’t involve the harbour bridge?
  • Government launched a $98 million dollar strategy to reduce Maori over-representation in prisons in August 2019. Now with the lowest numbers in prison (because they avoid putting people in prisons under this government – overall prison numbers reduced by 18%) but 53.4% are Maori (2017 was only 50.7%). Female: 65% are Maori – so it has gone the wrong direction – what was $98 million spent on? Will we ever find out?
  • Auckland Airport’s $40,000 grass painted (very temporary) welcome sign at wrong end of runway (predominant wind is westerly) for first arrivals after NZ opened back up from Covid, paid for by Tourism New Zealand & Auckland Airport. Not only was it at the wrong end, why was it needed during times of record debt & inflation?
  • Three months after NZ borders first reopened after Covid restrictions, government still spending $10 million a month on Covid contact tracing, one contact tracer without work for weeks left job as getting paid to do nothing & not ‘ethically right’.
  • May 2022: Three Waters spend-up: $14m on increasing Iwi/Maori understanding of the changes, $2.5 million of it to consultancy firm Martin Jenkins, closely linked to Doug Martin who is chair of 3 waters working group! $34 million in trying to sell water reforms to the public, $416 million spent on 3 waters to date even though the majority of New Zealanders & councils don’t want it and the next government has guaranteed that it will be reversed.
  • Energy Minister Megan Woods handed out $68 million worth of corporate welfare payments to major businesses replacing their boilers and heating systems. These businesses are massive, profitable operations. They already have strong financial incentives to improve energy efficiency, and they certainly don't need taxpayer help. The latest announcement saw capsicum grower Southern Paprika get $5 million to install a new biomass boiler. Meat producer ANZCO and textile manufacturer Canterbury Spinners each got more than a million dollars, and DB breweries got $500,000. And here's the shocker: the handouts won’t even reduce New Zealand’s carbon emissions.
  • Someone is being paid $132,000–$155,000 tax payer dollars to lead a team in charge of handing out awards to recognise people involved in the COVID-19 response. The prize is a lapel pin.
  • April 2022: Thousands of high salaried public servants have received pay rises despite the Government's pay freeze. More than 2500 Government workers earning over $100,000 a year got pay rises that were only meant to be granted in “exceptional circumstances”.
  • A 10-day jaunt to the Oscars by two NZ Film Commission officials cost taxpayers $58,000.
  • 2022 Budget: $14 million for an “historical account of the Dawn Raids”, then forgot to tell anyone to stop doing them. $185 million in arts and culture grants “to help build a resilient cultural sector as it continues to adapt to the challenges coming out of COVID-19”.
  • June 2022: Social housing waiting list = 27,000, which is 5 times more than when Labour came into power in 2017. Tax payer funding for transitional housing doubled in prior 2 years, now at $330 million, $62 million over their own budget.
  • June 2022: Communication staff has increased almost 50% since Labour come into power in 2017. In 2017 there were 339 ‘communication’ staff ($33 million), now there are 497 at $55 million dollars per year.
  • $336,000 spent for Jacinda to open Transmission Gully Road after cancelling many roading projects.
  • $220,000 spent on the ideal dates to mark Matariki and appropriate ways of celebrating the holiday.
  • Between March 2020 and April 2022, over $557,000 was spent by 31 government departments on off-site days. Overall, about half (49%) of away days were out of town, some in Resort and Spa’s in Martinborough. Two retreat days were in late February 2022, just as the country was experiencing historic highs of Covid-19 cases.
  • June 2022: 350,000 people on main benefits in NZ, 100,000 on ‘work ready’ benefits, yet Ministry of Social Development spends $100,000 on advertising fruit picking jobs rather than getting some of these beneficiaries the jobs.
  • RNZ used $43,000 tax payer dollars to pay for an Australian theme song for its NZ radio station.
  • May 2022: Labour government spent $2.7 million in advertising for 41,000 Covid jabs = $66 in advertising per jab, when in February = $3 per jab, March = $9 per jab, April = $29 per jab, May = $66 and at no point have looked at cost benefit, just kept ploughing along spending tax payer money. No one looking at best bang for buck, no objectives to measure effectiveness.
  • June 2022: Labour government just spent $10 million for 13 houses in Northland, above average cost, for social housing!
  • July 2022: Labour has increased government agency advertising spending 122% in last 5 years in power. $125 million dollars in last financial year compared to $56 million when they took power. The Department of Prime Minister & Cabinet was $2 million per year in 2017 (when Labour took power), in 2022 it was $26 million!
  • Labour has paid out $101,770,725 dollars in ‘clean car rebates’ (i.e. private electric/hybrid car purchases) until May 2022 and only gathered $14 million in takings = $87.8 million on tax payer to fund other people’s car purchases. One of the promises made is that it would be cost neutral – more ideology without any foundation.
  • July 2022: Labour has spent $1 billion a year on consultants after lifting the cap on hiring. Ministry of Culture & Heritage increased spending on consultants by 700%. Ministry for Pacific Peoples increased spending on consultants by 244%. The Education Review Office increased spending on consultants by 154%.
  • July 2022: Labour said to reserve bank that NZ tax payer would back the $100 billion printing of money if bonds dropped in value. Now that interest rates have gone up that equates to $9 billion in extra debt tax payers have to cover. That equates to $150-$200 million every month for 5 years to cover it. Australia’s government didn’t do this for that very reason.
  • Overseas kiwis, previous temporary immigrants and dead people received Labour’s $350 cost-of-living payment.
  • Government funded polytechnic to convert its workbooks and assessments for its level 3 automotive engineering course to Te Reo Māori.
  • Affordable housing agency Kāinga Ora buys Ferncliffe Farms partial swamp land on inflated valuations for $70.4 million.
  • Labour spent $415,000 to recruit a total of 3 critical care nurses.
  • Labour spent $600,000 in advertising tax payer funded half price public transport to current public transport users (including advertising in bus stops).
  • 4000 people get the benefit because they are “too stressed”, 2800 of them have been on the benefit for more than 5 years giving this reason. 4100 get a benefit because they are addicted to drugs, over 1000 of them have been on the benefit for more than 10 years giving this reason, costing the tax payer $76 million every year.
  • Nanaia Mahuta was associate minister when her husband's firm was awarded $72,999 Government contract to facilitate six meetings and 14 workshops to engage with Māori and to provide a “high-level overview” of the agency's Auckland housing projects – why do Maori need a $73k consultant just to organise some meetings?
  • In 2016/17 $13 million spent per year on market research & polls. Now under Labour its $28 million. PM’s office was spending $73,000 per year on market research & polls in 2016/17, now its $245,000. MBE was $1 million a year, now its $5 million, MPI $1.3 million a year, now its $4.1 million, Ministry for Pacific Peoples $60,000 a year, now its $520,000.
  • September 2022: Over $16 million has been spent on Three Waters consultant fees, which included $14,570 to produce one job description and almost $2 million for communication services. The Bill that creates their entities wasn’t even out of select committee, and the Government was already spending your money developing descriptions for jobs that didn’t even exist.
  • In 2022, Labour increased New Zealand’s deficit $5.1 billion to $9.7 billion. That’s $4,830 amount per household – money we will need to pay back.
  • Labour used more than $70 million from Covid fund to boost money in the 3 waters reform programme despite Grant Robertson saying they would focus unspent funds on meeting direct costs of responding to the pandemic.
  • Under Labour, NZ passports were changed to Maori being before English, not only on the cover but all through the passport – at a cost to the taxpayer. Now when any passport control outside of NZ goes to read the passport, they are confronted with a language they don't know before finding the English translation – that is a completely illogical move, wasting everyone's time, just to show more wokeness at any opportunity. It is the reverse of a cost v benefit decision, but typical of this government's waste & agenda.
  • $360,000 for research project taniwha: A Cultural History.
  • Taxpayers are having to spend at least $75 million per year on additional days off for Public Servants. In the year that’s been, taxpayers paid public servants for over 167,000 days that they weren’t even at work, excluding the normal four weeks leave and public holidays.
  • Jacinda Ardern was willing to spend $678 million to subsidise businesses to decarbonise, but says free dental care is an unaffordable dream. The 2020 estimated cost of free dental care was $648 million.
  • While staying at a London hotel in July 2022, Minister O’Connor and his staffer spent $475 on laundry services for just two days' worth of clothes. The Minister appears to be a serial clothes-spoiler. His own receipts show that just two days prior he had used the laundry services of another hotel, this time in Belgium.
  • Kainga Ora spent $204,897 on koha between 2019-2021 (interact with marae or have someone perform a ceremonial role, majority of time it has been a monetary contribution).
  • Road to Zero – $62 million dollars on advertising to slow down etc and yet the worst death toll on roads last year ever.
  • James Shaw in October 2021 updated Paris agreement target for NZ is to pay $12.8 billion to developing countries for them to plant trees over the next 10 years.
  • $514,000 overseas recruitment ad campaign to recruit more health professionals from overseas (and that's not including video production or consultant cost) ‘a failure' after just 3 people were interviewed.
  • Trade account deficit worst it has ever been at 33.8 billion, 8.9% of GDP (spending more overseas than we are earning – average since 1988 is 3.7 per cent) This was the largest deficit since the Stats NZ series began in 1988, and saw the International Monetary Fund (IMF) rank New Zealand the third-worst performer among advanced economies.
  • Grant Robertson has increased education spending by 46 per cent since 2017, from $11.1 billion to $16.2 billion. The extra $5.1 billion has had similar results to Robertson’s $1.9 billion more for mental health (nothing improved with minimal increase to the pool of mental health professionals).
  • April 2023: 3 waters spend so far: $56 million on consultants, $18 million on permanent staff, out of $94 million. Some consultants on $646 per hour, $220 per hour for a ‘strategic advisor’ in Maori.
  • The government has announced a $25.7 million annual funding increase for Radio New Zealand and an extra $10 million for NZ on Air this year following the collapse of the RNZ-TVNZ merger. This is with the main purpose of extending Maori content & viewpoints on public radio. ZB breakfast show is no.1 in NZ by far (3 producers), a distant 2nd is RNZ breakfast show which has 17 producers… no wonder extra funding is needed.
  • 800 more DoC staff but less pest control than before. Government sending massive amounts of tax payer dollars overseas for other countries forests instead of using that money on ours.
  • Tax take relative to GDP, on 2021 data NZ sits at 33.8 per cent vs Australia at 28.5 per cent and the US at 26.6 per cent.
  • Government bonds & treasury bills are now at $106 billion which is 75% more than May 2019. $29 billion dollars required in more debt than what Labour calculated 9 months ago. To service this is $6 billion in just interest repayments (equivalent to all expenditure on Police, Corrections & Justice). Interest repayments now forecast to be $10 billion in 2024.
  • Communications staff in core public service up 50 percent since Labour came into government.
  • Auckland Transport (AT) spent almost $20,000 on taxicabs to Harry Styles concert at Mt Smart for about 1000 concertgoers when key railways lines were closed and buses were too busy.
  • More than $1 million tax payer dollars was given to people who didn’t fill in their census on time (bribes), $934,000 went to just 12,000 people (supermarket vouchers, petrol vouchers & movie tickets), $96,000 on Warriors tickets along with an entry to win a trip to Australia. Now (unsurprisingly) many are not going to fill in their census next time until they get something for free for it. Next, they will be incentivising offenders to sit on roofs with free KFC to bring them down.
  • Minister of Statistics & Deputy Government Statistician had a budget of $210 million for the 2023 census, it is now $317+ million (50%+ over budget).
  • May 2023: The Ministry of Youth Development spent $300,000 of taxpayer money making three videos. The first two received less than 200 views each on YouTube, and one hasn't even been posted there! How many counselling sessions could this have paid for?
  • A charity in Rotorua dealing with troubled people gets most of its $4.66m budget from government contracts. From the Ministry of Housing & Social development, their contribution in 2021 was $237,000, in 2022 it went to $2.9 million in one year – to deal with security & gangs and trouble within emergency housing in Rotorua. Labour’s ideology around being soft on anti-social behaviour and criminals is failing badly to say the least.
  • Healthcare spending is projected to rise from $17.2 billion in 2018 to $26.4 billion in 2024. Where are the results?
  • Why have education departmental expenses risen from $1.3 billion to $2.2 billion? The run-rate for departmental expenses has been faster than front-line expenses.
  • An additional $46 million has already been sunk and lost into these scrapped policies: Social Leasing, to provide vehicles to low income households; the Biofuels Mandate, which was to be implemented on April 1 2024 (delayed from April 2023); the TVNZ-RNZ merger; and the Income Insurance Scheme (delayed indefinitely rather than cancelled outright). Labour says it has saved money, but only in the same way that you might save your belongings from a burning building that you’d set alight yourself. And efficiency – which means getting the most output for the least input – has been badly scorched.
  • Twice the money being spent on kid’s school lunches than needs to be because ideologically they want everyone in the school to get free lunches if only a few students need it.
  • Government giving away $140 million to NZ Steel to help buy an electric furnace, even though they had one in the 1960’s but just didn’t use it. This is at the same time their owners Bluescope posted a $2.6 billion profit and also while investing billions in new plants in Australia to burn coal for the next 20 years. Meantime Transpower warns of potentially tight winter power supply.
  • Labour spending more than $30,000 per household per year above when it came to office. What’s to show for it, what has improved?
  • While hard working New Zealanders are getting taxed more than ever, beneficiaries through no effort have been given a 48% payment rise during this Labour government. Debt owed to government by beneficiaries has ballooned to $2.5 billion, owed by 600,000 people by on average $4167 each – repayments now need to be more than the winter energy payment.
  • $35 million subsidising people who could afford Tesla’s to buy Tesla’s.
  • New Zealand pledged to spend $375 million reducing greenhouse emissions and protecting communities in vulnerable countries. But according to official documents, millions of that went into planet-heating dairy and meat farming. The Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade funded projects to establish dairy farming in Fiji and Myanmar. Between 2015 and 2020, it also funded work to intensify meat or milk production in Laos, Sri Lanka and Uruguay.
  • June 2023: A branch of Treasury – NZ Debt Management (NZDM) is going to Bond market for $4 billion more than expected in December last year, a total of $120 billion of gross bond issuance for next 4 years – more than the previous 4 years which included Covid. Therefore, government can’t blame Covid on everything. The selling of them relies a lot on foreign investors due to the size of it, and this will likely lead to a NZ credit downgrade.
  • The paper trail tracking the Government’s handling of $640 million in the Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) was so poor that auditors had to ask officials to recall what happened in their meetings as there was “little to no evidence” of record-keeping or note-taking. There hadn’t been an “evaluation of the benefits” either.
  • On July 1st 2023, the following taxes increased: Petrol excise by 29 cents/litre (including GST), Road user charges by 56%, Ute tax by up to $1725, Alcohol tax by 6.6%. All to help fund Labours excessive spending.
  • Hipkins took 2 planes to China in case one broke down while Labour declared a ‘climate emergency’. $33 million spent on maintenance on these planes in less than a year, on top of $70 million spent in last 5 years, when you can lease a brand new Boeing for $4 million a year. Firstly reported as ‘nothing unusual’ to take two planes, then flipped to first time it has happened. The Acting Prime Minister claimed at the time that taking two planes overseas was cheaper than flying commercial. It turns out Hipkins’ extravagance cost the New Zealand taxpayer between $62,000 and $97,000 per hour. Ten times more than the $8,730 per hour that was reported at the time.
  • Jacinda declares a climate emergency then makes multiple flight attempts to Antarctica for a jolly during a cost of living crisis.
  • Dirty coal purchased from Indonesia doubled & burnt to produce electricity.
  • Instead of using NZ wool to recarpet more than 600 rural schools, the Labour government has gone with synthetic carpet from America.
  • Despite the recession and the cost of living crisis the IRD is spending $30 million on doing up their own offices.
  • Three Waters cost blowout expected to hit $1 billion in ‘mega-bureaucracy’ – the extra cost of creating 10 new Water Services Entities (WSEs).
  • The Ministry of Business, Innovation, and Employment (MBIE) treated some of New Zealand's Space Agency staff to business-class flights to Washington DC, costing $31,000. They attended the 25th Annual Federal Aviation Administration Commercial Space Transportation Conference. But the trip wasn't just about the conference itself. MBIE officials decided to extend their stay for a leisurely five days. The conference itself lasted only two days. The officials enjoyed the luxurious Grand Hyatt Washington Hotel, incurring a bill exceeding $5,500. Seems like a very tone-deaf policy during a cost-of-living crisis.
  • NZ deficit for the 11 months to the end of May 2023 stood at $6.5 billion, which was $2.1 billion higher than the forecast Labour released in the Budget. While Grant Robertson likes to compare NZ against other countries, the Australian Government’s cash surplus for the year to May was A$19 billion, massively ahead of the A$4.2 billion forecast in its Budget.
  • $249,815 for exploring Fat (Bias) within Health Spaces for Māori, will look at fat bias within healthcare settings for Māori and how it contributes to and is part of a system of oppression that inhibits and restricts access to wellness and equitable healthcare – but the recipient is a ‘young wahine Māori doctoral candidate’ – already laden with bias.
  • The tax payer paid free school lunches programme which was given an extra $323 million in the 2023 budget to keep it running until next year has resulted in up to 10,000 school lunches leftover each day and in July a Treasury report was hugely critical of it with found no evidence of impacting attendance or benefiting ākonga Māori – who make up around 48% of students receiving the free lunches.
  • Treasury warned Labour the big pharmacies (including Australian owned) would pocket up to $70 million from free prescriptions in last budget.
  • Ministry of Education spent $1 million tax payer dollars on advertising kids should go to school with ‘no expectation to raise attendance rates’. An additional $7.7 million allocated on top of existing budget to retain Maori & Pacific kids in school.
  • Despite Labour committing substantial funds to build 100,000 ‘Kiwibuild’ homes, 6 years on only 1.8% built.
  • Labour inherited an economy where the Government spent $27 out of every $100, or 27 per cent of GDP. This year it is forecast to spend $33 out of every $100, or 33 per cent of GDP. The Government takes up a bigger share of the economy, but produces less. The simple question is ‘what have taxpayers got for the extra money?’
  • Since 2017 when Labour took power, MSD has granted 628,659 emergency housing special needs grants at a total of $1.4 billion. In 2017 the average length of time in an emergency accommodation was 3.5 weeks, now it is 26 weeks.
  • All employees from the Department of Conservation will get paid $3500 (of tax payer money) if they attend a Maori language course.
  • The cost of cultural reports for reducing court sentences of offenders: in October of 2017, it was $3300 per month spent on them, by May 2023, the cost is now over $630,000 per month of tax payer dollars. One of the recipients was the Auckland CBD shooter who would have been locked up rather than out in the community with an ankle bracelet if didn’t have a cultural report.
  • Social services education council ToitÅ« te Waiora chief executive Donovan Clarke spent just over a year on the job before an employment dispute saw him spend six months on paid leave meaning taxpayers were left with a bill approaching half a million dollars. Clarke’s publicly-funded card had been used to pay for alcohol and lobster in Sydney, numerous post-midnight taxi trips and that the $72,862 in total spent by Clarke over 11 months was more than twice as much the five other Workforce Development Council chief executives combined. ToitÅ« te Waiora is one of six Workforce Development Councils set up by the Labour Government this term to bolster vocational training and education.
  • Labours polytechnic mega-merger was designed to address a 2019 polytechnic funding shortfall of just $40 million but has had over $200 million spent on the merger so far and now Te PÅ«kenga is looking for a further financial injection of $422.6 million from Government over the next four years. Labour was warned the Polytech merger wouldn't work, and it is already facing a $110 million deficit and criticism that it has not done enough to prepare for taking over industry training and polytechnics in 2023. Stephen Town (chief executive) had been on personal leave from his job which pays up to $13,000 a week and still getting paid until he finally resigned.
  • Despite his abrupt departure midway through an independent workplace probe, the former KiwiRail chief executive was paid out $500,000 for the notice period he didn’t work out.
  • Three Waters: so many people leaving due to the uncertainty of the reform that they are now paying cash retention payments to stay – not costed or budgeted for, just further expense for something that National/ACT government is going to abolish. This is yet another clear indicator that the transition risks and costs of Labour's Three Waters reforms are much greater than Labour would admit.
  • Let’s Get Wellington Moving (LGWM) project: Despite the lack of asphalt laid, consultant expenses have already exceeded $130 million, while the overall costs have ballooned from $2.3 billion in 2018 to $7.4 billion – that's $3,766 per Kiwi household, just for Wellington. It comes as no surprise that the only project completed by the bureaucracy to date is a $2.4 million pedestrian crossing – so much for getting the city moving.
  • Despite Labour opposing the PÅ«hoi to Warkworth highway (remember Chris Hipkins and Grant Robertson labelling it the ‘holiday highway'), they couldn't give up an opportunity for a knees-up! Having learnt nothing from the lavish Transmission Gully opening ceremony last year, Waka Kotahi – along with Auckland Transport this time – spent at least $44,380 on the opening ceremony for the PÅ«hoi to Warkworth highway.
  • Four members of the New Zealand Film Commission (NZFC) staff embarked on a jaunt to the French Riviera, courtesy of your hard-earned money, costing $73,000. They spent $31,000 on plane tickets, $24,000 on wining and dining in style, and hosting a series of events, including ‘producer speed dating', and $17,000 on lavish accommodation. They arrived in Cannes five whole days before the festival officially kicked off and stayed for three days after it wrapped up.
  • Parliament's new ‘Te Kāhui Mōuri' (2 wooden Maori poles) unveiled in July 2023 cost $500,000, described as “tone-deaf” during a cost of living crisis when Kiwis are “being asked to tighten their belts”.
  • Spending on health is up 48% since the last election yet A&E waiting times are through the roof. Law and order spending has increased by 27%, but the country is gripped by ram-raiding and violent crime.
  • Labour is now spending 82% more than in 2017 without any clear KPIs because the Public Services Act brought in by Labour has disconnected accountability between the elected minister and the chief executive of any department.
  • Westpac chief economist expecting debt blowout: Government expected to borrow $35 billion more than planned eight months ago.
  • Over $380 million per year on first year fees free tertiary study with little positive outcome.
  • Deputy head of the Department of Internal Affairs gets a $17,000 welcome party.
  • TVNZ was paid $300,000 & Stuff $200,000 by Government agency EECA to air a series of climate change pieces which wasn’t made clear to viewers/readers that it was paid content (political propaganda) as opposed to independent editorial decision-making.
  • August 2023: Kainga Ora is spending quarter of a million dollars every month to lease a Wellington apartment building, only to leave half the flats completely unfilled and only 10-20 per cent occupied most of this year. In total Kainga Ora has lost $3,512,151.67 since December on the unoccupied units. The Project and Facilities Manager complained about Kainga Ora’s inaction in May.
  • The Government’s housing agency Kāinga Ora is under fire for spending $312,025 a year on seven expensive Bloomberg computers. Kāinga Ora had been issuing its own debt. This meant the agency could borrow to fund its housing build programme on its own, without going through Treasury, like most other government departments. It issued about $2.5 billion a year and currently has $12.1 billion in debt in its portfolio.
  • Ministry of Education bought 100 million face masks using tax payer dollars during Labours Covid fear & control campaign, the majority of which are sitting in storage costing $26,000 every month, over $350,000 already up to August 2023. They can’t even give them away, no one wants them, so are spending $120,000 to dispose of them.
  • Port Chalmers cycleway build included moving the main trunk railway line so cost $44 million dollars = $5 million per kilometre! Wellington cycleway is costing the tax payer $314 million, Waikato cycleway beside the express way has been funded at $3 million per kilometre – none of these will be tolled like new roads.
  • Net Debt is going to be 22.8% to GDP in 2024, in 2019 it was 1.8% (that’s a 12.6 fold increase).
  • The IMF report shows NZ has the 2nd largest fiscal deficit of any advanced country in the world at present.
  • September 2023: Labour spinning Prefu results as good, the reality:
  1. We are not returning to surplus until 2027 – Labour has now pushed out a surplus 7 years straight, which is worse than after the GFC & Christchurch earthquakes.
  2. Tax revenue is dropping compared to what Labour forecasted.
  3. Expenses are rising from what they originally thought.
  4. Debt to GDP is worse.
  5. Next government Bond issue (debt) to 2027 is worse.
  6. Inflation is higher for longer.
  • Before the last election, Labour promised spending this year by the government would be $116.1 billion, but they have spent $139 billion.
  • IRD data shows over 50,000 people owe almost $238 million to IRD – massive increase under Labour.
  • MBIE = 137% increase in head count, Ministry for the Environment = 62% increase in head count.
  • Tax payer funded university running a project & offering financial reward to participate in Māori perspectives on forensics data.
  • Kāinga Ora's deficit has blown out to more than two-and-a-half times that forecast for the 2022 year and more than double last year’s deficit. Wages and salaries, excluding benefits up 48.9%.
  • $6.4 million on a campaign to young men to ‘own your feelings'.
  • Millions spent on Covid app Blue tooth tracking then was never used as intended.
  • The Institute of Economic Research: Annual average GDP forecast to slow to 0.4% in the year to March 2024 (due to massive government spending that manufactured a recession).
  • Statistics NZ was giving gang members tax payer incentive payments to complete their census forms.
  • Corrections NZ giving $100,000 of tax payer funds to gang members to remove tattoos.
  • Maori private business given tax payer money e.g. $14 million given to Wai Ariki Hot Springs and Spa.
  • Labour handed out $70 million in tax payer dollars to set up 30 Iwi lead community panels instead of courts for Maori offenders.
  • This Labour government caused the biggest avoidable spend in NZ history brought on by sheer incompetence by being the slowest OECD country in the world to start the Covid vaccine rollout and actually decreasing ICU capability compared to March 2020 (384 down to 300) costing billions in lockdowns to protect hospitals.
  • Labour is spending $650 million tax payer dollars in corporate welfare to subsidise businesses (many of whom are very profitable) to cut emissions that they should be responsible for. $162 million for Maori organisations to reduce emissions, including $36 million for “matauranga [traditional knowledge]-based approaches to reducing biological emissions” and $30 million for “Maori Climate Action”.
  • $188 million for the separate Māori Health Authority which National is going to repeal.
  • $100 million to support centuries-old treatments called “maramataka” – the Maori tradition of using the moon and stars to help treat mental health issues.
  • $6.2 million was allocated to develop a Treaty partnership programme to ensure Maori ‘participate in, benefit from and make decisions’ over anything identified as ‘taonga’.
  • Labour announced a $730 million Maori housing budget to build 1000 homes and repair 700 ‘owner-occupied’ homes over four years.
  • Labour committed over $100 million on a business case for Lake Onslow pumped hydro scheme while knowing that National will repeal it.
  • $20 million establishing new “Iwi-Maori Partnership Boards” (i.e. introducing co-governance to the new health system).
  • $3 million for “marae connectivity”.
  • The Auditor General found Labours $30 million purchase of Ihumatao land (post full & final local Iwi Tribunal settlement) to be unlawful because it did not seek the correct approvals from Parliament, then little has happened with the land since in terms of the housing programme it was purchased for.
  • $178 million for councils dealing with RMA reform with a new “National Maori Entity” to co-govern resource management.
  • $11.1 billion allocated to restructure & run the new health system during a global pandemic.
  • April 2022: The OECD warned months ago that the country needs to rein in its spending.
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If anyone thinks this Government has a remote squidgin of financial and economic competency, you have rocks in your head. It will take a generation (and possibly more) to dig NZ out of the hole these clowns have dug us into. And if you vote for this Government again, you are part of the problem and nothing to do with the solution.

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And lastly, it's a stain on the media in NZ that they have failed to dig this stuff out themselves. And because all this stuff is public record, you have to conclude they don't dig it out because it doesn't fit the narrative they want. Literally every one of them should hang their heads in shame. Or just give their job away, as they are not reporters, just people giving their opinions, like every other person.

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What's your day job?

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Retired a couple of years ago at 60 Kate. My "day job" now is spending quality time with my wife, tending my garden, continuing my extensive reading (though just got rid over 3,000 books), cooking as many bbq's as I can, spending as much time as I can with friends and family, laughing and travelling around the world. Why do you ask?

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If you have to ask why then I expect you've completely missed Kate's well made point.

(And your reply confirms Kate's well made point.)

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Lol Feeling, "well made point". There was only one reason she made her comment. However, I assumed that anyone commenting on this site during the day doesn't have a job. Else they'd be being lazy or employed by the Government. Of course she had nothing at all to say about the wall of shame. Not that any Labour supporter could, because one cannot rebut facts. So my response was completely over your head Feeling.

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Just curious given your distaste for media (aside from Basset, Brash and Hyde's blog).  I'm always interested in what folks that read that sort of attack blog (and it stated it was a 31 minute read!) - and others like it - do for a living.  Same as I was always curious about what people who read Cameron Slater did for a living.

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I appreciate it was a decent read. You might be interested to know a I didn’t get it from BB&H. But I wish I did, as I see they didn’t have the boxes and other stuff in it. Would have made it a lot easier to read. And I don’t have a distaste for the media, just NZ media, as it is bent so far to the left it’s an embarrassment, and that’s not to even start on the quality of so called journalists. I do read The Australian, SMH, The Australian Financial Times, Washington Post, New York Times, The London Times, Spectator, Le Monde, Jerusalem Post, Press Trust of India and Der Spiegel (it’s so much easier now you can get it online in English, my German is a bit hazy these days) among others. Oh, and I’m not sure that I’ve read anything from Cam Slater for a good few years, so you really must have nothing to do if you searched back that far.

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A way to counter disinformation is to read widely.  Both Brash and Bassett are extremely knowledgeable with qualifications and resumes to match.  I look at their site occassionally and I look at many others too.

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Is that a veiled (poorly) ad hominen attack? Why don't you find fault or an inaccuracy in what was posted?

 

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IVV - you haven't read a d...ned thing about the Limits to Growth, have you? 

Ignorance comes in two forms; we all start knowing nothing, and that's fine. We can all learn. 

What I think is indefensible, is choosing to remain ignorant. 

There is NO WAY 'BACK', regardless of who is in power; there isn't enough planet left to consume. Luxon's mob will just be more bewildered, by a slight margin. 

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At least powder, I acknowledge I don’t know everything. Nor do I read one book, article etc and hang my hat on it. I would suggest you are slightly rabid, and do not have the same faith I have in human adaption and ingenuity. You do realise that the likes of you have been claiming peak oil since the mid 60’s?

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With that attention to detail you should be working for the National Party...they have trouble producing a tax policy document that isn't mainly pictures of Mr Luxon smiling and holding a baby...rock solid...but me thinks you probably already are ;-)

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At least we'll be back on track though. :-)

https://tenor.com/view/driver-cliff-wheee-gif-21502913

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Not that it makes it right. But there is a probable link between this "Meanwhile, in 2017 individual tax payers paid the government $33 billion. By 2023 this had gone up 67% to $55 billion " and the spending shit list that appeared below it. As in, where do you think that additional 22 billion of PAYE came from?

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And yet it is probably less than a month of Superannation at $1.5 bill or 2 months at $3 billion. I think you need to look at the bigger picture.

All governments spend money on projects they want to pursue. I'm sure the next government will have a similar list of transgressions, except theirs will benefit the big end of town like PPP.

 

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It speaks to their character Inthecentre.  Do you think taxpayers should be paying to maintain maraes?  And if so, why am I also compelled to do so from my hard earned money?  This kind of stuff is bordering on corruption.

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Whoever concocted that list is economically illiterate.

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Sounds like the  present government 

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Was pretty entertaining. Too little, too late from Hipkins but he was definitely the winner on the night. 

Luxon. Just one straight answer would be nice. 

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Lets face it Luxon is not up to the job.

They would have had a better chance with Nicola Willis

My pick would be a one term Prime minister if he got in.

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I think someone more reserved like Shane Reti would make National much more palatable.  If you've seen him up against Hipkins in previous health debates, you wouldn't have thought they were opposition party members.  

The problem with Willis is she's far too assertive, shouty and angry which can come off quite obnoxious and tiresome.  

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Agree. Dr Reti is always a well considered and informed interviewee. Probably he is singularly committed to addressing the issues in the health sector. Also Erica Stanford has the same manner, good preparation and presentation, nice calm humour about her too.

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Quite like Luxon, although more so than Nat policy

I think him quite clear on what he says.  He portrayed a clear plan quite often last night, as much as the format allowed.

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Slogans are not a plan. 

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Who is Winston Peters? Don’t know the guy.

Winner of the night was Paddy, given the moderation we’ve had thus far. 

The punches Hipkins did land were right on the nose. But he was a bit like a bull in a China shop, ravaging and going down swinging. The China, Nationals policy. Empty, as there is still no plan on how they’re actually going to do any of it.

Pointless debate with no fiscal plan from National. They are, as everyone keeps pointing out, a slogan wagon.

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Luxon does have a bad habit of sloganeering - reminds me a bit of the Ramaswamy guy in the US. Unable to give a concise answer - has to go on with another and another and another sentence for the purpose of 'educating' all of us... but never getting on to the practical policy answer.

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Fairly well shown by now that he is not a natural politician and likely never will be. Still results speak louder than words and to put it simply  getting those results will be what defines his prime ministership, one way or another. Personally I would prefer an identity natural and effective but boring,  over the flim flam of a facetious, flippant fibber.

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Gotta question his judgment of the real world when he suggested police should interrupt a funeral to take the patches off 500 gang members.

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Certainly not a quick retorter. For instance Hipkin’s loaded question about racism by a lowly NZF candidate should have been easily countered by the same question about the CIS white male nasty outburst by no less than the co-leader of the Green Party.

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I don't think Paddy Gower should have let that quote by Hipkins be read out.  It was obviously Hipkins taking on the role of moderator, rahter than candidate.  But yeah, effective for Hipkins and Luxon had no comeback.

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Huh? I thought sloganeering was giving short slogans instead more complex answers? You say it's the opposite?

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I refude that....... he's in it for you, wants to get NZ cracking and own our future. Jobs, growth, health, working for tomorrow today. This one's about trust, so lets do this. 

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This one is about ignorance - his too. 

To be sustainable - that means to run a long-term maintainable system - requires several orders of de-growth from our current unmaintainable consumption level. 

What were your books? Wilbur Smiths and back-copies of Playboy? 

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More likely the hard copies of Playboy methinks. Regardless of direction or base, ignorance is hardly difficult to detect. Regrettably though birds of the feather flock together. And here we have again political parties submitting to the electorate, some listed contenders who have been exposed as sexist, racist, elitist, misogynist and simply, full of phist. This is as incomprehensible as it is inexcusable. Our parliament is, or should be, a serious arena for serious business. Yet somehow, our political parties, all of them, wilfully allow identities that are unqualified. inappropriate and maladjusted to be included in the mix.

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I didn't watch however I'm told that Gower was the winner because as usual he couldn't shut up & let anyone else speak.

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I think Luxon was referring to Peter's in the I don't know him light as to he doesn't know exactly what his demands will be if NZF gets over 5%. Luxon made it pretty clear if you want to get rid of Labour just vote National. To me Hipkins is just waffle he cannot recall any facts or numbers or will not admit there are problems like in health where clearly things have got worse on his watch.

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Luxon had some good stats on health but the important point is how you are going to reverse those trends.  Hipkins' answer was the right one - prevent ER and hospital admissions by warmer houses, no barriers/admin fee on pick up of prescriptions, better access to primary care, equal pay for nurses in GP surgeries and respite/elderly care, etc.

I'd add school nurses to that mix.  My mother was a school nurse in the US - she was paid as per the teachers - same package.  And the amount of proactive childhood disease screening, puberty onset complications, vaccination and mental health (e.g., ADHD, dyslexia and the like pre-screening) was massive.  Many of her referrals of students were also direct from the teachers who had concerns of one type or another.  These are things that prevent the need for GP appointments - she had the ability to make referrals as well (by passing the need for a GP and/or making a recommendation to a GP for simple prescriptions, such as a course of antibiotics or steroid creams for skin infections).

She could also administer topical applications, such as for suspected strep throat etc.

We just need to get much, much smarter on disease prevention and early intervention.  

 

 

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There are school nurses in some schools (maybe lower decile?). The one in my daughter's school used to do things like throat swabs and contraception advice.

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Yes, need a full time nurse in every high school and a part time one in every primary school. It's a really attractive alternate for nurses in the US as they get all the school holidays off, just like teachers. Very family friendly job.  To my mind, a nurse is far more necessary than a social worker/counsellor - not that the latter aren't a good thing, but a nurse can provide both types of service.  Some teens will open up to a medical professional more so than a social one.

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The fact that all the health stats under Labour have collapsed (and that's just the ones they've been bothered to report on) and you are still flying Hipkins (who was Minister of Health as the stats collapsed) flag for him Kate? You really must be a hardcore Labourite. 

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Hipkins answer was the wrong one because its obviously not working after 6 years. Luxon said the government would pay down Nurses and doctors student loans to the tune of $22K a year after 2 years I think it was if they stayed in New Zealand. Luxon has the ideas, Hipkins is a possum in the headlights.

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He's a bit of  dhead if he hasn't bothered to read NZ Firsts policys which bye and large seem fair and reasonable to me. They are all on the site for all to read

 

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Gower failed as the (smarter) first interviewer failed. 

The real existential question(s), hanging over NZ RIGHT NOW, were not addressed. Not even on the radar. So - as per normal - the NZ media let the politicians off the hook, and kept the NZ public in the dark. 

How many times did that cock crow, again? 

 

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Pretty hard to raise existential questions when the basics aren't even being done correctly.

Although maybe it's all related.

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Luxon talked about Nationals policies and Hipkins talked about Nationals policies.

There was only one party on display tonight.

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but neither could explain nationals plan on HOW they are going to do anything, hipkins  landed a few, but how chris, give an answer chris, from luxon was just management speak all fuffy bunnies and rainbows but no idea on how it will get done, that is for the underlings and if they dont get it done that big new shinny blue bus will be rolled over the top of them 

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Looks like its back on tick.

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I didnt hear much about policies, more about National's vague talking points. It did really show up that there is not much substance to their "policies"

National are favourites to lead the next coalition, on the numbers it looks like a re-run of the 1996 election, but with NZF and ACT swapped. Therefore it is only fair that they are called out for their empty spin.

A lot of people said Ardern was all about the empty spin, so far I am not seeing any real difference with Luxon, asides from his delivery is a lot more wooden.

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Is it me? or do Luxon and Hipkins seem to be closer to each other in their political views than they are to their prospective coalition partners. Both sitting.ever so slightly to the left and right of dead centre.

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Is Labour giving confidence to National inconceivable? Better outcome for the left than having ACT and NZ first calling the shots?

And V.V.

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The global parameters are changing - fast. The concepts we have held for a generation or two, are becoming obsolete. National and Labour reflected a boss/worker paradigm, and Chloe Swarbrick is here to show us (old binary fogeys) what the future might look like. 

It's not hard to see Labour and National getting hollowed-out, to the point they merge in the middle. There aren't many points of difference. 

And they're both of the past - National more so, perhaps. 

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Do you even know what the alternative should be?

Because it sounds like your bent would be for some sort of Luddite regime, and typically when you impose something like that, both the young and capital flee (they already are, but the numbers would accelerate significantly)

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re ... "Both sitting.ever so slightly to the left and right of dead centre."

That's how winning works in a 'democracy'. You only need to appeal to the 5% of swing voters in the center and you've won.

Sad. But true.

Or put another way, the average I.Q. is just 100. (20 points below and you're retarded and 20 above and you're smart.)

Thus Chippy and Sloggany are appealing to to those with IQ between 99.5 and 100.5. (Sorry, that a joke in case you didn't get it. They're actually appealing to those around the 95 level. Another in-joke - smarter people usually vote to the left.)

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At least it's not like the USA, where only votes in 4 or 5 states really count.

 

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So red label Coke won over blue label Pepsi? How lucky we are as a nation to have such diverse choices from the professional marketing men.

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Luxon's  inability to answer questions should be off putting to voters. Except I don't think Voters want to hear any bad news , they just want a tax cut . hence he had a win getting away with promising to resign if they don't provide tax cuts , but dodging the foreign tax part.

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Governments lose elections in NZ, and NZ basially flip flops left to right every 6-9 years. . Labour is basically at the end of its time and they know that, but will never admit it.  National will basically win by default, and will bring along  two ugly parties with them.  

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I think a lot of people have been exposed to the $250 a fortnight advertising and haven't looked any further.

Post election they're going to be pretty disappointed to find it's per household, and you need 2 children aged 3-5 to qualify, and most people will end up with 10 bucks a week.

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Is this where Nat-Luxon fan club meet?

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The  announcement of a Minister for Mental Health by Luxon is fantastic news. And was relevant to the question, as recent studies show that LGBT kids have higher rates of suicide. Labour , disappointingly,have been hopeless at addressing youth suicide. There is not enough affordable, available counselling, there is no central 'pointsman'  to make holistic solutions, vulnerable youth are not supported, and there needs to be wider, nationwide conversations on raising awareness of the problem.   I am an advocate for youth suicide prevention here and overseas, and my experience in NZ, unlike elsewhere, is that I have been silenced.

   I have had  a book out that over the years has saved young people's lives - they contact me even today to tell me it made them decide not to kill themselves. A few years back I had a meeting with the then Labour-appointed Suicide Prevention Officer to see if they would help support the book. She just kept referring to a govt study and said that took priority and plans were being implemented.

  When I pointed out some obvious holes in the govt advice - you can't meet the ideal of youths leaving school with qualifications to be employed and feel valued, if there are large truancy rates - she said that was not a ministry of health problem but a ministry of education one. ie a silo approach. I felt the whole topic of youth suicide made her uncomfortable and she just wanted me to go away. Her current replacement works hard but prioritises Maori youth suicide prevention. This is great, but really, every child is precious.

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How do you 'council' your way out of having next to no chance of a future in the country you were born in?  I am referring to being able to buy a house and have children if desired while competing with the rest of the world for a job here (due to immigration).

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Yeah, look, that's the one elephant problem in the nation that we don't talk about Murray, please tow the line and figure out other ways to keep people dosed up on hopium regardless if they can afford stability of the potential of having a family 

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You're competing for a job with the rest of the world regardless of whether the competition is in NZ or outside of it.

And the concept of having a family hasn't been a priority in NZ for 20-30+ years. Good luck bringing that back.

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There's a big difference though, between 10k migrants and 100k migrants per year diluting the job market.  

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All the 100k does is highlight that NZs population seemingly requires a steady stream of migrants. You get 100k when you have nothing for 2-3 years. 

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What about prior to C19?  My 100k was hyperbole, it was more like 70k net migration. 

NZ's population requires a steady stream of migrants to keep the wage bill down, while creating more "consumers" for businesses to expand and cater for and driving up scarcity/values in housing.  A nice big wedge of divide.  

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You'd almost think the entire nations' existence was dependent on migration.

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If the nation was selling residence visas for a profit maybe?  Or bringing in new residents to help grow our export market.  

Otherwise I think you'll find more people = more resources we need to import = trade deficit grows?  

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The health service is certainly dependent on immigration 

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Hi Murray, thanks for your comment. Just to clarify, in my original post, when I talk about the ideal of a young person getting qualified and gaining employment and being valued by society, that was the the ideal of the government document. It is not my ideal, as I know it is unrealistic, and also perpetuates the notion of a person only having value if they an economically productive unit.

There should also be an ideal of alternative futures to that. Some people's brains are just not wired to fit in with the particular neurotypical demands of the workplace, or as Kate points out, they come from families that have enough problems just coping day to day.  Or as you point out, they are citizens who do no longer can even find a place in the workforce as they have been undercut by migrant workers. It's a huge societal issue.

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It was an acknowledgement of how difficult this area must be combined with a suggestion that more money to the ambulances at the bottom of the cliff won't fix the problem either unfortunately.  Literally a place (home) in society is barely obtainable now, you don't need to be in your own home all the time and at all stages of life, but you certainly need to have a realistic chance of obtaining that security but currently we're flat out denying it to the young.

When I see things like "Prisoners with unstable housing are nearly five times more likely to be reimprisoned within their first year of release than those with stable housing, a new report has found." (Prisoners need support for stable housing to avoid reincarceration - report (msn.com)), it starts me thinking that mental health issues might be five times more likely with unstable housing too.

It would be refreshing to see those picking up the pieces also call out a potential solution for the people they are trying to help instead of only asking for more funding to address the symptoms (mental health issues) of the problem (lack of housing/work security and realistic hope).

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I think white males have had the highest rates for decades, we need better publicists or an acronym or something.

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David, I haven't got the stats to check, but my observation is that it is a big problem in rural areas particularly. What I have seen is that rural communities have given up on reaching out to institutional support, and have formed their own groups to lift up their isolated menfolk.

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The  announcement of a Minister for Mental Health by Luxon is fantastic news. 

Possibly, but its just more bureaucracy.

To my mind, the key to teen mental health is a stable family environment. Parents, and their living circumstances/life style choices matter. My guess is (altho I haven't seen the stats) is that children being raised in sole parent households, or violent 2 parents households are more at risk. 

Mental health therapy doesn't solve the problems at home, i.e., feeling of abandonment; not knowing your one of your biological parent's due to relationship breakups; dealing with a string of different partners coming and going from your primary caregivers life, etc.. And then, if we look backwards from the child to the parents - again (my guess but I haven't seen the stats) it's likely that poverty is the primary cause of relationship breakups - i.e., no stable place of residence; insecure or poorly paid employment; use of debt to pay for basic essentials, etc.

Until we address the social ills of the adults raising children, I suspect child/teen mental health will continue in a downwards and often tragic spiral.  Many children in youth justice facilities will repeat offend because the people looking after them in YJ are caring, have time for them, feed them three meals a day, provide regular hot showers, basic clothing and a bed of their own.

No sense in more expenditure on the bottom of the cliff - let's address these problems before our kids plummet off it.   

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You are right to a certain extent Kate, but there's also an epidemic of mental health ills in stable, middle-class families.

They cut themselves, they have eating disorders, they are suicidal, they have anxiety and depression - among families I know.

There's something about modern day life that's very toxic.

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Kate, absolutely it is a systemic problem and you make excellent points. Yes, there is a danger a Ministry of Health could just mean more bureaucracy, but I am part of an organisation that has successfully lobbied for a suicide-prevention office under a ministry to be set up in a country overseas. One problem such a ministerial office addresses, and which I have seen is an issue here, is that there are heaps of organisations and individuals working in various ways to help address mental health problems, but the hapless troubled individual desperately needing help just gets overwhelmed & doesn't know where to turn. So such an office or ministry can coordinate all this  so as to better inform those who need help. It is also extremely useful at the policy level, if you get smart people with lived experience on board, they carry weight and can influence the powerful boards in relevant govt agencies. This relates back to your point, Kate, about systemic issues (forgive me for paraphrasing and apologies if I have  interpreted wrongly) and that if you have the right people involved under a high-up/ministerial umbrella, going straight to the top and non-confrontationally presenting to policymakers and agency heads the grim reality of their decisions can be a strong, sudden spur for change.

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Yes, I hear what your saying. And you definitely interpreted me right.

We do have a Children's Commissioner and a Minister of Children already.  

First point of call would be to ask what specifically they have done in this regard?  On the world stage, our stats on teen suicide are horrific.  If I was either of them, I'd have at the very least commissioned a study to explain why we are such an awful outlier in this area.

We all have our suspicions as individuals who are concerned - for example, I wonder whether children are given cellphones of their own at an earlier age here than in comparison to other OECD countries.  Or are mandatory school uniforms an issue?  there could be any number of identifiable factors-of-difference, surely.

Best wishes in your advocacy.  We need more people like you trying to effect change/turnaround in this area.

 

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It was a really poorly run debate and was almost run more like a boxing match, with an after fight interview with the players. Surely they can mute the others mic to let each other talk. Pretty sure they have done this in previous years. The problem is that Luxon hardly ever answers questions, and politicians that play that game should be held to account IMO. 

I say bring back the worm.

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I say bring back Hosking to moderate. I never could stand him but no one else has got near the std he set in 2017.

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Yep he was excellent, and I am not a fan if his.

I find gower hopeless.

It is the gower show and all he wants is to create awkwardness as that is his happy place.

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Hosking is the biggest cheer leader for the red team makes me want to vote for them just listening to him.

But I try not to listen to his-unbalanced  BS.

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I'd love to see a 30-second muted mic penalty each time one of them failed to answer a question.

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Hi Mr Luxon

chinese middle class are selling foreign property 

So much for your revenue???

 

https://amp.scmp.com/economy/china-economy/article/3235448/chinese-inve…

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That's the Chinese middle class who buy in SE Asia. The rich Chinese with millions will still want to buy in NZ.

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Yeah Right

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The National,New Zealand First and Act government will never work egos are way to big to make a go of it.

Also if the best the National Party can come up with is restarting the Ponzi scheme god help New Zealand and its younger generations.

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We now possess the technology to deliver a purely voter led party, just no on can get their act together enough to drive it.

Instead we treat our politics like a streaming service, expecting something truly captivating amoung a sea of mediocrity.

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The Nats and ACT will work it out.  The Nats will have to respect the votes ACT gets.  And ACT must respect the votes the Nats get.  You know, grown ups.

Currently that's about four to one.  It's not biggest takes all.

 

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I'd say Luxon took half a dozen big hits.

Paddy also challenged him three times on whether he would resign if foreign sales tax didn't raise the planned income. He didn't answer and ended up laughing at himself. 

Also Paddy raised the Luxon's "tantamount to murder" views on abortion. Given a quarter of women will have an abortion in their lifetime according to Family Planning, he will lose some votes on that. 

Also Luxon has been forced to disown Winston and call him "not good" etc . Winston will be burning up inside. If National drops a few more points I see a period of 6 weeks as Winston negotiates. The result may not be a Luxon govt. 

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Tova’s piece in Stuff says Helen called Hipkins and gave him a rark up before last nights debate.

Its frightening that she is still behind the scenes calling the shots.

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Its frightening that she is still behind the scenes calling the shots. 

Do you need a hug?

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Not from Helen, I am good thanks.

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How about Sir Joh Key..just hope you font have a man bunn?

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Not sure why it is frightening, much like the old guard of Key, Joyce & Bennett are still pulling the strings behind National.

Clark was one of our most effective Prime Ministers in recent times, she has good political experience and knows a lot about how the game is played.

Clark was also probably the last PM that wasnt all about Spin and managing the message. She could be brutal and she could get things done. Traits sadly missing in today's political leaders on both sides. 

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Yes, she's an amazing politician.  So wish she'd got the UN top role.  Wow, what a different place that would be.  She's a cut through the bureaucracy in order to get things done - a leader that leans on funding operations as opposed to policy.  For example, she turned around DOC in that regard. More important in the UN than in NZ!

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Clark ran a tight ship which is what Labour has lacked this term.

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Yeh, tova's "sources" As if anyone close enough to the P.M are likely to tell her about a rark up from Clark. 

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Ummm, luxon didn’t answer the question about Winston either rather he said he didn’t know him. Abysmal performance from a man that wants to lead the country. 

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Did Gower anyone ask Hipkins if the Greens were good for the country?

If not, then it wasn't a fair question. I didn't see the end so don't know.

Gower was trying to setup Luxon, he also needs to setup Hipkins.

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the Greens are tgood for the country , but the main thing is they have been in cooperation with Labour for 6 years , and are a known factor.  

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The Greens and Te Pati Maori combined with Ardern are a major reason why Labour are losing so many votes.

The country believes they are bad for the country.

Edited.

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Hipkins could have pointed out Luxon doesn't know Peters , because he's only been in politics for 3 years.

But I guess enough damage had been done. but surprised he doesn't highlight Luxon's political inexperience. 

Seymour and Peters will run rings around him . Both parties list get pretty "interesting" after the first few top places. 

Again in the climate section , he could have asked Luxon what Air NZ did for carbon reduction under his watch.  This section was very light, considering its importance. Gower seemed more interested in drugs.` 

 

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It is an interesting point.

Climate change for NZ is solely a financial decision as nothing we do within reason makes any difference.

Financial meaning that we need to do the right thing to ensure our products are marketable while not spending so much that we cant afford to make them.

Luxon should be better at expressing that logic given his background.

Hipkins will just waffle and argue about National record on climate change.

 

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Leadership is always done by a very small group.

NZ can play a massive role in climate change by providing leadership.

You're selling NZ down by saying "nothing we do within reason makes any difference".

NZ can be a Winston Churchill.

I believe we can. Clearly you do not. 

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Made me wonder whether he actually understands the history of politics in NZ.

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Interestingly whilst Luxon did not answer the question on whether he would resign if he couldnt raise enough money from flooding the property market with foreign speculators. He did say in a throw-away comment that he would resign if he couldnt deliver on tax relief.

ACT and NZF are pulling back from their tax cuts plans given the fiscal environment and likely hit to inflation. If they put a stop to National delivering tax cuts - will Luxon resign?

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Hipkins, Mr 20%

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Stupid debates and Stupid media hype 

This election is about the direction of travel the country heads, either left wing policies or centre right policies not about who got hits on who in some televised entertainment show 

 

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Floating voters generally only watch the first debate. Only followers of politics (and who have generally made up their minds already) watch the second. Hipkins had his arse handed to him in the first debate, not because of anything particular he said, but because Luxon looked and sounded Prime Ministerial, and Hipkins didn't. The game is up for Labour. And thank goodness for that. Worst Government NZ has ever had.

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Dunno. I might have been swayed by that debate.  Have been a TOP fan (still am) but I might party vote Labour just to keep National/ACT/NZF out.  As my husband pointed out - had either Winston Peters or David Seymour been in that debate, they'd have eaten Luxon for breakfast. Point is - they know what they want to do!

Hipkins, on the other hand, could defend successfully against both of them very easily, because he knows what his own governance principles are and many of the ACT/NZF principles are the antithesis of LAB/Hipkins'. 

  

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Kate, It's better to vote for what you want and not get it, than vote for what you don't want, and get lots of it.

TOP are not going to get in parliament this election, but if you don't vote for them they never will. Nor will any other parties notice the support they get and so cherry pick their policies. 

I have voted for TOP in the past, and because others did too they are still alive and coming up with alternative ideas. Personally I won't vote for the current iteration as I find them too woke.

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I hear you. I've always been more firm in my convictions - but there is something really scary about a NAT/ACT/NZF coalition to me.  We do not need a race relations war such as is the case in the USA.  It is very hard to recover from going backwards in that regard. 

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I am with you in preventing deteriorating race relations as the single most important issue facing us. There is absolutely no good future for NZ as a divided country.

You will need to explain to me though just how Lab/Grn/TPM will settle things down when they have really stirred it up this last term.

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Yes, I get that too. We cannot make co-governance work by executive fiat - and that was their big mistake.

But when I watched the Rawiri interview with Jack Tame;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCoofCbrgq8

I thought to myself - he's not stirring the pot - he's simply saying the Treaty gave Maori rangatiratanga (chieftainship/rule) over their own people - and the Crown, kawanatanga (governance) over tauiwi/settlers.

Never quite turned out that way however and assimilation hasn't worked out as well as it could have.  So I'm all for giving the Treaty a proper go - not the Treaty principles (I'm with Winston Peters on that one) - just the Treaty itself (the English interpretation of the Māori version that was signed by the Chiefs).

    

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And yet that not what the Maori elite are talking about.  They want seats on local councils, they want never ending access to public money.  If all they wanted to do was manage their own land, most people wouldn't give a damn,

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"their own land" - do you mean their remaining own land or does this include the land that has been stolen from Māori since 1840?

Te Tiriti covers rangitiratanga over much more than physical land - do you include the other tāonga under what Māori should manage? Wai?

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How are the current race based policies helping with race relations?

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Remember who started it.

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Top has come out as my best match in the last 2 elections on vote compass. I presume it is because I don't prioritise the more extreme Social and economic policies of the Green party . However environment been my top concern, thats what decides my vote. 

But i do wonder why TOP are not doing better. Especially as people are looking at alternatives to the main 2 parties. 

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What does TOP stand for?  If you're not sure, then that might be your answer right there.

Per Beanie above, they have evolved, some things I like and others less so.  For example, I don't see any evidence that TOP 1.0 was incorrect to only want people to stay permanently if they raised the standard of living for everyone already here.  Yes, some win from immigration such as the business that employs them, but if an existing citizen loses a job or house at the margin, then it's a 'thanks, but no thanks' per Gareth's original policy from me.

I'm a member and going to vote for TOP due to their LVT and tax-free threshold - finally a serious shift in direction I have long wanted is actually on offer by a political party!

Anyway, I'm off to drop off some flyers to try and get Raf over the line in Ilam!

 

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My point is more a small party with sound policy, should be up around 5%.i would think the polls make it hard, wasted vote syndrome. I think a form of STV should be added to our MMP system.crazy to think a vote for,say a left party, that doesn't make 5%, your vote gets split between left and right, so 1/2 your vote goes to a right party.

Good luck in Ilam.

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TOP have a lot of polices which makes it hard to tell what they really stand for was my point.  Are all their polices sound?  I've been vocal about one I don't think is - immigration, well not if you want lower house prices at least.

STV would be great, many councils use it.  A lower threshold to 1/120th of the vote would be more representative too, more than happy to give the 'crazies' an MP or two for the sake of them feeling heard/represented.

Just finished the route before the rain arrived, another to do tomorrow.

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My point is more a small party with sound policy, should be up around 5%.i would think the polls make it hard, wasted vote syndrome. I think a form of STV should be added to our MMP system.crazy to think a vote for,say a left party, that doesn't make 5%, your vote gets split between left and right, so 1/2 your vote goes to a right party.

Good luck in Ilam.

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Their land tax is a stupid policy and puts a lot of people off I would say.  Raf actually has a lot of knowledge around banking and finance, so you wonder why they haven't advanced policies in that space? 
 

Personally, I think one answer to the housing crisis is to require banks to assess residential investment loans as business loans and based only on the rental income v loan payments stacking up.  They should also ban using equity is existing homes being used as “a deposit”.

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Lack of visibility.  Their was a youth debate the other night - my 17 year old grandson watched it - but TOP (the most youth-focused party) weren't there.

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Let us not forget that hipkins is part of the biggest con job that has ever been thrust upon the people of New Zealand.

Just a National also normally have a secret agenda.

The salvation is party Vote NZ First to bring some protection to us all.

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Which con job is that?

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Think they are talking about the National tax package.

A cynical con job.

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Time will tell.

The criticism is coming from a party which has funded its own promises by spending money which was printed for covid.

Now that is cynical.

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No that's following the global sheep mentality.

I agree a total disaster.

But Pfizer did very well out of it just follow the money back.

And everyone lined up for an amazing robust immune system.

Yeah right.

Mainly baby boomers National supporter I think.

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A National, ACT, NZ First government and a pre Christmas mini budget. I wonder if Kwasi Kwarteng is a available for a consultancy gig.

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To be honest, I turned the so called debate off last night.Hipkins was aggressive, spoke  over Luxon repeatedly ( a debate is when you listen/ be respectful of other’s opinions Mr Hipkins )and I felt lowered the standards  previously I had respected him for. In the past, I quite liked Hipkins and felt some empathy for the mess he inherited. After last night that has changed and I now see him as just another politician who will treat others inappropriately just so he can win an election.

While some may feel Hipkins won. I felt a sense of lose. A sense that in Aotearoa, we have got to a point of no return.Gutter politics is disturbing and distasteful.

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As of today, Bishop Tamaki (soon to be the self- appointed Pope) will be the obvious choice!!!!

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The obvious choice should be to throw him in jail for ripping off his followers.

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Too little, too late from Hippy.

But a Luxon pattern has become clear. It has become autonomous. And it speaks volumes.

And, to me at least, is extremely worrying.

Have you noticed that whenever Luxon is faced with a question he either doesn't want to answer or clearly doesn't have an answer for, he responds with 'blah, blah, blah ... but we're the only party that will deliver tax cuts to middle NZ'. Or something to that effect.

One trick pony? Or just another seriously untrustworthy wannabe politician?

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He's a man out of his time, and out of his depth. 

Baldwin and MacDonald in England, Forbes and Coates in NZ, are classic historic examples; all men of their past. 

Few see the future clearly - even Churchill got bits wrong - but it is NEVER the past. Therefore those who are about the past, must be invalid. 

Simple logic...

 

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Churchill undoubtedly got more wrong than right. But what he got right, were the big ones.

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Labour pulling out the racism card… gutter politics; reeking of desperation… hope you Labourites feel proud!

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Classic tactic of accusing others of the gutter politics you are doing.

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Yes, we are heading into the next three years where the emphasis will be on debt reduction and saving rather than borrowing and spending. I predict 6 years of this before the country tires of this approach and elects a 2017 style government.

It's rinse and repeat stuff. The sky will have to fall in before anything really changes in NZ.

 

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We haven't watched any of them as they were doomed before the started. Suffice to say that it would be nice if that 3rd maori tv channel was given back to the rest of new zealand and tv3 should take note also. But we now watch ut-ube tv and read the overseas newspapers now  so its no real worry but all the taxpayers money poured in is.

I  have to agree that there is some worry about National and certainly Act. This leaves NZ First who are the champion of us pensioners.

Its a no brainer - party vote NZ First

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Yes, I've received my voting forms half of the bumf is in English and the other half in a foreign language.

But when do I get my KFC vouchers please?

There was a time when a wee bio of the candidates was included, times have moved on.

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