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Monday's Top 10 with NZ Mint: China's 'Bridges to Nowhere'; Better ways to measure GDP?; A Latvian implosion; The Long Finance movement; Dilberts

Monday's Top 10 with NZ Mint: China's 'Bridges to Nowhere'; Better ways to measure GDP?; A Latvian implosion; The Long Finance movement; Dilberts

Here are my Top 10 links from around the Internet at 10 past 2 pm, brought to you in association with New Zealand Mint for your reading pleasure.

I welcome your additions and comments below, or please send suggestions for Tuesday's Top 10 at 10 via email to bernard.hickey@interest.co.nz.

I'll pop any surplus suggestions I get into the comment stream.

1. Is GDP a real measure of output? - Last week's GDP figures slumped in part because fewer people used their phone to make toll calls.

Instead they're using Skype and email more, and prices are falling.

It shows up as less GDP, but people are still getting the same or more 'value' out of their telecommunications.

HT Neville via email..

Here's Helen Twose at the NZHerald on this.

2. Another way to boost GDP - China's growth miracle seems more miraculous and/or fraudlent by the day. China Hush reports many Chinese buildings are blown up and rebuilt just a few years after they are built. This 'boosts' GDP because new concrete, steel and other materials are used to create new output.  HT Zerohedge.

This is in effect China's version of Japan's 'Bridges to nowhere'.

Ever wonder how China can endlessly generate goal-seeked GDP of precisely 8.00001% year after year? Or how it can constantly find use for the massive and ever-larger surplus of warehoused commodities? Simple - never stop building. Which, apparently means blowing up empty building before they are even finished and rebuilding them. Rinse. Repeat.

After all gotta keep all those construction workers from rioting, and all those USD reserves redirected into Brazilian and OZ commodities, now that China is not really buying US debt anymore. China Hush has some stunning pictures confirming that in its search of the great home bubble perpetual engine, the politbureau comrades may have stumbled onto the bricks and mortar equivalent of Shangri La.  

3. Competitive devaluations - The world is descending into a series of devaluations by very stressed economies willing to print themselves out of the mire.

It is a type of tragedy of the commons in an era of deflation. Whoever prints first wins. Those who don't print because they are trying to be 'good' are the last ones standing when the music stops. Southern Europe appears to be the one being left on the sidelines (along with New Zealand....).

Here Andrew Balls from Pimco, the world's biggest fund manager, talks about the risks of a rising euro. He doesn't mention that the Germans are doing OK.

The U.S. has its own problems, not least its high level of unemployment and a social safety net that is not designed to cope with these kinds of structural problems. The U.K. is attempting its own fiscal adjustment, based upon what looks like fairy tale assumptions and false logic, but at least supported by currency deprecation. Japan remains in the mire. China is unwilling or unable to move away from an export-led growth strategy that served it so well under old normal conditions.

But the eurozone is in an extremely poor position to cope with a rising currency. Indeed, if the ECB takes the money supply data as seriously as it professes, it should be very worried and perhaps pursue quantitative easing for domestic reasons rather than just to protect itself from the international game of beg-thy-neighbor. There are a wide range of possible outcomes as the eurozone attempts to cope with its peripheral problem.

The euro strength makes the negative fat tail risks fatter. Something has to give. The global economy faces a classic macrofinancial coordination problem, in which the eurozone is one of the chief losers, and further stoking protectionist pressures in the U.S., which is hit with its own shock of high structural unemployment without the social safety net to cope.  

4. And we thought Ireland had it bad - Latvia was one of the fringe EU states to be hit hardest by the Global Financial Crisis. Jamie Smyth at the Irish Times took a visit to the Eastern European country to find a country worse off than Ireland. Latvia is in a complete mess. HT Brendan via email.

The extent of Latvia’s collapse is shocking even for Irish observers. Since the recession began at the start of 2008, Latvia’s gross domestic product (GDP) fell by a quarter, one of the biggest falls in output of any country since the Great Depression. The unemployment rate has tripled, hitting 22 per cent at the start of 2010 before falling back to 16 per cent in June. Tax revenues fell 30 per cent last year and government debt is projected to rise to 74 per cent of GDP this year, up from just 7.9 per cent in 2007.

Martins Bicevskis, Latvia’s state secretary for finance. “We would have had a big economic decline due to the global financial crisis in 2008 but it certainly wouldn’t have been so deep if our system wasn’t so weak.”

Bicevskis blames several factors: a property boom inspired by successive governments’ lax fiscal policy, which provided tax breaks for developers and low taxes on real estate; a flood of cheap money into the economy from foreign banks, particularly from Scandinavia; huge increases in wages prompted by labour shortages; and the global liquidity crisis.  

5. They knew all along - Shahien Nasiripour at HuffPo reports that many Wall St banks knew they were buying very Sub Prime mortgages through the US housing boom, but did it anyway. HT Nikki via email.

During a little-noticed hearing this week in Sacramento, Calif., a firm hired by Wall Street to analyze mortgages given to borrowers with poor credit, which were then packaged and sold to investors during the boom years, revealed that as much as 28 percent of those loans failed to meet basic underwriting standards -- and Wall Street knew all along.

Worse, when the firm flagged those loans for potential issues, Wall Street banks ignored its recommendation nearly half the time and likely purchased those loans anyway -- selling them to unwitting investors who were never told that the biggest home loan due diligence firm in the country had found potential defects in these mortgages. The revelations give a better picture of what many have likely known for years: Wall Street firms knew they were buying lead yet passed it off as gold to investors who had no knowledge of the alchemy behind the scenes.  

6. Trickle down doesn't work - Mark Thoma points to some interesting statistics showing tax cuts simply don't work to boost the economy and that trickle down economics is a fraud.

The chart shows the number of people earning over US$200,000 who legally paid no tax. HT Troy via email.

7. Long Finance -  A  conference was held over the weekend in London that talked about 'Long Finance'. This is where people start looking at financial decisions in terms of generations rather than nano-seconds. Faisal Islam at Channel 4 News has a summary. It sounds a lot like the 'Slow Food' and 'Slow news' movements.

This is evidently an issue of profound interest to economists and financiers. The financial crisis illustrated bankers and traders were incentivised and thus obsessed with time horizons of no longer than the next bonus round. High frequency trading in the City and on Wall Street, suggests the natural unit of financial time consciousness is getting shorter, not longer, and is probably close to a nanosecond.

Some hedge funds invest hugely in the physics of their telecommunications links to trading systems, so that they can make huge trading profits from giant bets against traders with marginally slower links.

8. The lobbyists won - Avinash Persaud from Intelligence Capital spoke at the Long Finance conference about how the lobbyists for the banks had gutted any real chance for reform through the Basel III process. Here's a piece he wrote for VoxEU on all of this.

The argument that the banking system is too broken and the world economy too fragile, to support more onerous regulations, is seductive for politicians desperately trying to boost consumer demand. But it is suspect. It highlights that attempts to make banking regulation more counter-cyclical have not gone far enough. The point of counter-cyclicality is to loosen the constraints to lending in times of recession like today and to tighten them when growth and optimism have returned and the worse credit mistakes are being made. Counter-cyclicality needs to be at the heart of the new regulatory regime and not an optional extra.

As Professor Charles Goodhart of the LSE and I have said before, crashes will not be avoided if we continue to feed the booms. The methodology of counter-cyclicality is complex and given that economic cycles are more national or regional than global, it makes for greater host country regulation and national ring-fencing of bankers’ operations. International banks do not like that. To counter they appeal to the “right”-sounding notion of level playing fields.

9. The race to the bottom - Ambrose Evans Pritchard has an excellent piece on the various attempts by central banks to print away their problems and the competitive devaluations that are now happening. We seem to be heading inevitably for trade and capital controls. Is that such a bad thing? HT Andrew via email.

The US and Britain are debasing coinage to alleviate the pain of debt-busts, and to revive their export industries: China is debasing to off-load its manufacturing overcapacity on to the rest of the world, though it has a trade surplus with the US of $20bn (£12.6bn) a month. Premier Wen Jiabao confesses that China’s ability to maintain social order depends on a suppressed currency. A 20pc revaluation would be unbearable.

“I can’t imagine how many Chinese factories will go bankrupt, how many Chinese workers will lose their jobs,” he said. Plead he might, but tempers in Washington are rising. Congress will vote next week on the Currency Reform for Fair Trade Act, intended to make it much harder for the Commerce Department to avoid imposing “remedial tariffs” on Chinese goods deemed to be receiving “benefit” from an unduly weak currency.

Japan has intervened to stop the strong yen tipping the country into a deflation death spiral, though it too has a trade surplus. There is suspicion in Tokyo that Beijing’s record purchase of Japanese debt in June, July, and August was not entirely friendly, intended to secure yuan-yen advantage and perhaps to damage Japan’s industry at a time of escalating strategic tensions in the Pacific region.

Brazil dived into the markets on Friday to weaken the real. The Swiss have been doing it for months, accumulating reserves equal to 40pc of GDP in a forlorn attempt to stem capital flight from Euroland. Like the Chinese and Japanese, they too are battling to stop the rest of the world taking away their structural surplus.

We have a new world order where China and India are buying gold on every dip, where the West faces an ageing crisis, and where the sovereign states of the US, Japan, and most of Western Europe have public debt trajectories near or beyond the point of no return.

The managers of all four reserve currencies are playing fast and loose: the Fed is clipping the dollar; the Bank of England is clipping sterling; the European Central Bank is buying the bonds of EMU debtors to stave off insolvency, something it vowed never to do just months ago; and the Bank of Japan has just carried out two trillion yen of “unsterilized” intervention.

Of course, gold can go higher.

10. Totally relevant video of game of muscial chairs, apropo the competitive devaluations above.

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40 Comments

The highlights of,

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/comment/ambroseevans_pritchard/80263…

“It is a serious question. We are no longer talking about a single country having a big depression but the entire world.”

Things are just getting worse....interestingly why does a country need to invade another....just kill it internally with economic forces which will cause politcal ones,

".........China is debasing to off-load its manufacturing overcapacity on to the rest of the world, ......................Premier Wen Jiabao confesses that China’s ability to maintain social order depends on a suppressed currency. A 20pc revaluation would be unbearable. “I can’t imagine how many Chinese factories will go bankrupt, how many Chinese workers will lose their jobs,” he said."

"Japan has intervened to stop the strong yen tipping the country into a deflation death spiral"

regards

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2. God what a waste of priceless energy....

regards

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FYI the Waikato Times reports a probe into a Te Awamutu accountants office

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/personal-finance/4171662/SFO-sifts-ashes-of-investors-left-burnt

Sounds all very Timaruvian

cheers

Bernard

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Dont you love the weasel words

A spokeswoman for the SFO said the matter was under assessment.
We can't give any comment around it at this stage.
We cant comment because it is before the courts.

The US system is preferred where they put you in handcuffs, do the PERP walk, give you a photo opportunity, then let you go.

If you want to make a difference it would be instructive if you had a "continuing" page on your web-site containing the details of every investigation carried out by the SFO over the past 5 years, the date of commencement, dates of any updates, followed by the end result of the investigation. Otherwise the public interest is subverted by the elapse of time. When it is finally published in the news media - if it ever is - it becomes a case of who? who was that? what did they do? Oh yeah that was 5 years ago. Boring.

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It seems there was plunge protection squad for the Euro, WSJ.com reported.

"Two months after Lehman Brothers collapsed in the fall of 2008, a small group of European leaders set up a secret task force—one so secret that they dubbed it "the group that doesn't exist."
Its mission: Devise a plan to head off a default by a country in the 16-nation euro zone."

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240527487034670045754641136057315…

cheers
Bernard

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Pot calling the kettle black?

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huh?

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You just have to wonder just how long we have before this goes pear shaped....

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These tensions between China and Japan are not going away, despite the boat captain being handed back.

 

"Some Chinese customs offices have started stricter checks on shipments to and from Japan, causing delays, in what may be retaliation against Japan's recent detention of a Chinese fishing boat captain, the Mainichi newspaper said on Monday."

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE68I06520100927

cheers
Bernard

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Mark Thoma ( # 6 ) draws entirely the wrong conclusion , in " trickle down doesn't work " . Progressive taxation , which places an onerous burden on the upper income earners , back-fires . As Cullen showed here in NZ , soon after introducing the 39 % tax to grab the " rich pricks " , as he so eloquently called them . They surged into rental properties and use of LAQC's en masse , as a response .

Hardly surprising that they rebelled against an abusive prat of a finance minister , who sought to redistribute their earnings , to bribe himself into another election win .

They didn't get to be high income earners by being simpletons , unlike politicians .

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signed: Lord Roger Thomson 2, Castle Drive Lowburn

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signed : Lurid Roger Thompson ; Panay Bay ; Baranguay Maninila ; Philippines !

[ my comment was aimed at his conclusion about high income earners paying minimal tax , not about  the efficacy of the " trickle down effect " ]

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GBH, trickle down economics IS rubbish. 

 

Cullen's approach to it was also rubbish too though....

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We have has thirty years of "trickle down" it hasnt done a thing for 90% of the Western World....at best the upper-middle class (8%) have tread water while the top 1% made huge gains....which they have never spent....so in fact its pretty clear the reverse is true.

What we have entered is the second gilded age which you are unable to see.....

High earners yeah right those who gambled with other ppls money, Bernie Madoff was dis-honest, and immoral, sure he wasnt a simpleton.....he was a fraudster....as its looking are many of the highest earners.....some 92 year olds were left penniless....

Change is coming though....tax will be far more progessive in the future than it is now, significantly so.

So you may as well start puking now.

regards

 

 

 

 

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GBH - there's adifference between being selfish, and being intelligent.

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There is ? I can't understand that . Kindly expatiate your point .

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1#  One argues that we should measure well-being and include both subjective surveys and sustainability as components of that measurement. I have no quarrel with measuring well-being, but there is no reason to foul up a useful statistic in doing so. GDP is but one indicator that policymakers can and should use to analyse the economic health of a nation, and it is foolish either to use it for a purpose for which it was not intended, or to attempt to change it to suit one’s policy goals. A doctor who monitors only a patient’s pulse is not doing his job, but one who argues we should ask the patient how he feels and call that his “pulse” is outright dangerous.

 

http://keithhennessey.com/2010/04/28/economist-debate/

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Re: #2 - "many Chinese buildings are blown up and rebuilt just a few years after they are built. This 'boosts' GDP"

We do exactly the same thing in NZ except they are called "leaky homes". 

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or earthquakes........

regards

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"It looks like a silly little thing but it has had a massive effect on growth and GDP over the last year, so we're saying the economy is not performing as badly as the official figures are suggesting."

Stephens expects a revision of the GDP figures as the measurement of the internet-based activity is improved."

Sounds like wanting it both ways there Westpac, something breaks free from monetization - phone calls - and you want the rules changed. Didn't hear the call for an adjustment when child care or home cooked meals or the air we breathe any one of thousands of things that used to be free were dragged into the monetary system and boosted the GDP figures.

Guess you'll be wanting to put a price on the home vege garden next thing.

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God almighty that Evans Pritchard bloke is a laugh isn't he??? Makes Bernard look positively optimistic

Why don't we all slit our wrists?

Fact is the pessimists are usually wrong, as are the optimists

The reality is in the middle

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Usually, yes.....you are correct...this time however I'd love to be convinced this isnt going to be a traumatic event just like the Great Depression...

The GD of course proves by its existance/history just where the reality can go....

regards

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This is a chilling piece,

http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/

"The aggregate data is unambiguous: the US economy is delevering in a way that it hasn’t done since the Great Depression, from debt levels that are the highest in its history. The aggregate private debt to GDP ratio is now 267%,  versus the peak level of 298% achieved back in February 2009–an absolute fall of 31 points and a percentage fall of 10.3% from the peak."

"The aggregate level of private debt now towers over the economy, putting into sharp relief the obsession that politicians of all persuasions have had with the public debt.................8><................If they had paid attention to the level of private debt in the first place, then we wouldn’t be facing exploding public debt today."

"........with debt levels as high as they are, the potential for further deleveraging still exceeds the worst that the US experienced during the Great Depression."

"....when you consider the correlation between the “credit impulse” and the change in employment, this crisis has no precedent in the post-WWII period"

"debt is the leading factor is this process"

"Drilling down into the debt data, it’s apparent that the sector that caused the crisis—the finance sector—is the one that has delevered the most is also the one whose rate of delevering is slowing most rapidly."

"The finance sector exists to create debt, and the only way it can do that is by encouraging the rest of the economy to take it on. If they were funding productive investments with this money, there wouldn’t be a crisis in the first place—and debt levels would be much lower, compared to GDP, than they are today. Instead they have enticed us into debt to speculate on rising asset prices, and the only way they can expand debt again is to re-ignite bubbles in the share and property markets once more."

"...........reigniting these bubbles is easy when debt to GDP levels are low. But reigniting them when debt to income levels are astronomical is next to impossible. Speculators have to be encouraged to take on a level of debt whose servicing consumes a dangerously high proportion of their income, in the belief that rising asset prices will let them repay that debt with a profit in the near future..........."

 

So PIs who think they are leetz....yes well no need to say any more..........

For me its clear, this is the worst event since the Great Depression, it could be the worst event since the long depression........and Steven Keen hasnt factore din Peak oil yet....

Bummer.......

regards

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Goofy Phil says that a Labour Government would exempt fruit & vege from GST ........... to encourage kiwi families to eat a healthy diet .............. Any more gems in the pipe-line Phil , to assist us to be better , whether we want to or not ? Double the GST on McDonalds to save us from our gluttony ? Re-visit the squiggly light-bulbs ........ for our benefit . Folate the bread , to  mass medicate the entire population , as you had planned . Limit shower-head out-put ?

You are a facist Phil Goff . A dictator ! A nanny-state socialist , as well intended , yet every bit as utterly foolish as your predecessors Helen Clark & Michael Cullen .

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'Encouraging' healthy choices like eating fruit and vege whilst discouraging uhealthy choices like smoking is hardly fascist. You can still choose to eat rubbish and smoke a pack a day.

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Nanny-state ...... Dictator ........ Fascism : All tarred with the same brush . Why does the central bureaucracy think it is expert enough  to decide what is in our best interest , and to enact policies to " encourage " us into accepting choices that they have made for us .

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Because it listens to health professionals as opposed to lunatic fringe elements.

regards

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Vegitables have been GST free in the Uk for 50years?+   I wonder if there is any indication this has worked as intended. The data and not blinkers should show the best course.....oh and its LESS tax.

We hav an excess tax on chigs, which are killing NZers.....chatting to my dad last weekend and all the ppl he went to school with 60 years ago and smoked through their lives have all been dead for 5+ years ....mostly various cancers...at a cost to the health service.....oh and a nice way to go eh? Throat cancer, lung cancer....really nice ways....not to mention their ill health in their 60s while my dad still ran around playing golf every day.

Look at the life expectancy and obesity in the US....they produce beef with a high fat content because its aimed at burgers.....again huge health costs involved there.....so yes lets tax fat thats LESS tax....for the sensible ppl...

Wont happen though....too many Labour voters live in McD's.....crazy though, to feed my family there costs me $25~30.....I can get good ingredients instead (decent meat etc)  and cook at home for the day on that...

The light bulbs make economic sense individually in the right circumstances, mine are now all 4 years old (with two failues in that time)....in the frequently used areas they save you $. Nationally using them saves construction of more power stations and more transmissions lines....so we would have saved on our bill two fold....Ditto shower head output..........in fact thats a quadruple saving, save on pumping the water and more reserviors as well as the heating energy and infrastructure for that....thats LESS tax.....

Lets not forget bycle helmets I mean they save head injuries/lives, thats LESS tax needed to look after the resulting vegitables and no loss of that individual's capability of working....LESS tax.

You seem to miss the point differences between facist and communist......facists support the state and companies at the expense of the individual....Communists just the state...

A dictator doesnt get voted in....what we have are ppl chosing to vote for a system that offers them collective benefits at the lowest cost in many cases. They want it......so 100,000's of NZers vote labour and 1000 vote Libertarian...

What you are missing is the insidious taxation that goes on in the background.....mostly this takes the form of interest in debt we are stupid enough to take on without a net return on it..The result is the banks as intermediates and the super rich take a cut of real small businesses and ppls lives at every turn. In other areas they force up the prices of goods and we the ppl end up paying for it....thats MORE taxation in our lives....its just not labeled tax and collected for a Govn.

That has gone on for 30 years....now the illogical and expotential growing system that was created around us by the above trapping us has brought itself to our knees...and we the average joe will pay for it for the next decade maybe 3 while the super rich just sit there and laugh.....thats MORE tax we will pay as the result of LESS regulation that allowed the greedy and immoral to prey on us...

regards

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GDP

The biggest issue I have with GDP is that it fails take into account one of the backbones of capitalism: efficiency. When company’s and people become more efficient and more productive prices fall. Just look at the computer industry. How to you account for the fact that computers get more efficient and faster yet are cheaper year in and year out? The GDP would need a productivity bias to determine true GDP.

 And the Chinese story is a great illustration of the “broken windows” policy of GDP growth. One bright spot is that the Chinese are fast becoming world leaders at both building and demolishing structures.

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repeat

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Na Troy, the PTB have already thought of that. Anything to goose the GDP figures higher.

It's called hedonic adjustments, the computers contribution to GDP is adjusted upwards because of its greater memory/speed/features. The nominal GDP is then subject to a GDP deflater figure - similar to the CPI - that removes price  changes to arrive at "real" GDP.

Every distortion that can be got away with is used to make GDP higher - it's a one way street.

The impact of borrowed money entering the economy - no adjustment.

Free stuff being monetized - no adjustment

Government spending effectivley counted twice - no adjustment.

Government spending is a completely seperate entry in the GDP calc but Government employee wages and spending are included as well. Double dipping to the max.

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Capitalism isnt efficient....at least in a broad term comparing to GDP....its efficient at extracting non-renewable raw materials and converting it into an end product maybe and in the short term probably.

The Q is, is that product really needed?

etc etc

There are a whole swag of Q's to ask around this...

The US plunged into recession due to its own in-efficiencies and the horrendious cost of energy....can capitalism survive expensive energy? probably not as we know it....

The computer industry is not a good example....of this so called efficiency...

gtg

 

regards

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If it was left to a government department , the computer industry would consist of just 4 giant mainframe computers in the whole world ......... Capitalism is highly efficient and innovative .  . Capitalism produces what the market place demands ........ producers of unwanted or excess products go bankrupt . Compare the costs and staffing levels of public hospitals to those of private ........... and you amply see why the government needs to get out of the way of the highly efficient market .

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Ambassador for Intergalactic Relations : Oh my God ! Here is another gross inefficiency , a total headbanging waste of time and munny , as brought to you by the U.N.  The U.N. , in their wisdom have decided that the planet needs a designated ambassador to meet and greet alien species . Ms Mazlam Othman , the head of the U.N. Office of Outer Space Affairs will receive the honour  of meeting , swapping trinkets and tentacles with the visitors .

I am not making this up ! In the capitalist system , steven , this sort of bollocking nonsense is not tolerated . As you put it steven , "  this is a product that is not needed ". Which is why the U.N. is chock full of socialists , such as our dear Queen , Helen Clark . Their flights of fancy and ridiculous dreams are taken seriously there .

British physicist Stephen Hawking says that in the unlikely event that aliens do arrive , it will probably be to conquer us by force , rather than a stop-over on their way past .

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Oh FFS....

You sound like you are brainwashed.

Look at the effects on GDP for private healthcare in the US...its something like 16~18% of GDP and only does 75% of the population. V the UK and here where it does 100% and costs about 6~8% of GDP....thats more money in your pocket...

You are confusing Govn tax with a private tax....the result is you lose more of your income in a private healthcare system for a worse national statistic / outcome and more neg effect on GDP, its about double.

I spent over 10 years working in various hospitals....so I have some knowlegde of them.  Public hospitals have more staff for some very good reasons, they do specialist services like intensive care and A&E that private hospitals dont. Private hospitals are production lines set up to do the easy and frequent jobs and as such skimp on the safety items... plus they simply dont offer the breadth of care...they make their owners a lot of money...thats a tax in effect...

regards

 

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Go Steven. Correct. On form.

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Re your point (6), that graph proves nothing.

Try the hard data and research from Veronique de Rugy's article here: http://reason.com/archives/2010/09/20/austerity-agonistes 

Quoting:

In a 2010 paper published by George Mason University’s Mercatus Center (where I work), economists Robert Barro and Charles Redlick showed that in the best-case scenario, a dollar of government spending produces much less than a dollar in economic growth—between 40 and 70 cents. If that was the rate of return on our private-sector investments, America would soon cease to be a leading economic force.

Barro and Redlick also looked at the economic impact of raising taxes to pay for spending increases. They found that for every $1 in tax-financed spending, the economy actually shrinks by $1.10. In other words, greater spending financed by tax increases damages the economy. The stimulus isn’t working, because the economic theory it is based on is fundamentally flawed. 

 

I realise the argument here is that tax increases hurt an economy, so you might perhaps argue that it is simplistic to assume tax cuts grow an economy - which you are taking from the graph. So to destroy that notion also, I proffer this: http://cafehayek.com/2010/09/home-runs-at-the-wsj.html 

 

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Tribeless - don't be a dumb disciple to those who take things for granted.

"The Economy".

Oh, it's something real, is it?

Not just an artificial construct based on growth, only achievable on the way up?

The problem is - as sure as if you walk East you'll drown - we stopoped going up.

Permanently.

Those folk you follow, they're singing off an old songbook. Posibly an old track from Simple Minds.

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You are taking a very simplistic if not misleading view I think.

How about a URL to their paper?

Tax cuts dont grow an economy unless those tax rates were excessive in the first place...then yes there would seem to be a probable link / effect. Apart from that  for all the fancy arguments, if that were true the tax cuts under Bush would have led to a clear boom....another morning in America.....they clearly did not.

There are lots of counter arguments on the effects of Govn spending, Barro and Rednick offer one view....and Im pretty sure I read some pieces a while back heavily critising their work, tore it to shreads in fact.  The interesting thing is "your" economists work is generally in line with the school of thought that led us to this mess, ie it seems pretty dis-credited...

The stimulus has not worked because the theory said they needed 1.2trillionUSD and not 800billion...plus some of that was tax cuts/relief which would seem a very poor multiplier...and thats how it worked out....

Also we are talking about an overall tax rate? this could be achieved by a flat tax rate or a progressive tax rate.  When i look at the evidence for progressive taxation and again the Bush tax cuts are these in reverse we should have seen a boom....in fact when we look for some boom periods they seem to occur when more progressive tax structures were in place.

So for all the fancy thoughts and papers the experiment of the last 30 years is pretty damming against the free market and trickle down economics....its looking pretty crap really.

regards

 

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"dis-credited".

I like that.

I'll buy it     :)

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